Firearms shipping question

[RKarum]

I have contemplated selling a couple of military rifles but I do not have a FFL. If a person does not have a firearms license, is there any legal way to sell a firearm over the W-A and ship it to the buyer?
I want to do this right, I want to do this legal.

Thanks in advance...Rob.

[David Guist]

Hello I thought about doing the same thing but you have to have the license or ship it through a third party that does. I dicided that it was just to much trouble. Best regards.

[mudsharkangler]

For a C&R (pre 1946 basically) rifle, a private individual may only ship to a FFL holder...as long as they can legally own the weapon to begin with etc. Hope this helps.


<TABLE cols=1><TBODY><TR vAlign=top align=left><TD vAlign=center width=794>Shipment by Unlicensed Persons</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top align=left><TD vAlign=center width=794>Any shipper who does not have a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is considered to be an 'unlicensed person'. This section contains information on how unlicensed persons can ship firearms. If you have an FFL, please skip to the next section for shipping suggestions.
The most important thing to know is that you must only ship guns to a licensee. If the buyer is not a licensed dealer, he will have to make arrangements with a dealer in his state to ship the item to.

Before you ship a gun, the buyer must fax or mail you a copy of the licensee's signed FFL license. You can only ship the gun to the address on the license. You must inform the carrier that the package contains a firearm. Of course, the firearm cannot be shipped loaded; ammunition may not be shipped in the same box. You should take the copy of the signed FFL with you when you take the item to be shipped in case the shipper wishes to see it.
Notes on specific shippers:
US Mail: An unlicensed person can ship a rifle or shotgun by US Mail. Unlicensed persons cannot ship a handgun by US Mail. Postal regulations allow the Post Office to open your package for inspection. Ammunition cannot be shipped by US Mail. You can search the US Post Offer Postal Explorer site for specific USPS regulations regarding firearms and ammunition.
FedEx: FedEx will only ship firearms via their Priority Overnight service. Ammunition must be shipped as dangerous goods. UPS: UPS will accept handgun shipments by Next Day Air only. Rifles and shotguns can be shipped by UPS ground service. UPS will accept shipments of ammunition. UPS does not allow shipment of firearms FROM an unlicensed person (even to an FFL), unless the stated reason for the firearm shipment is for repair or modifications. Most other shippers will no longer
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[CH47]

I am an FFL holder both Class 1 and C&R. The Class 1 is a regular dealers license and the C&R I have to use with the C&R NFA weapons I buy for my personal collection.

Now to the question at hand, a non licensee may ship to a FFL holder through common carrier such as UPS, Fedex or DHL. They are also allowed to ship long guns through the USPS. This is stated in the previous post.

Shipping through an FFL holder is really no problem at all. Most FFLs charge a small fee for the service, for example I charge $10 over the cost of shipping. The FFL will handle the transfer by requesting the receiving FFL supply a signed copy of his FFL, once that is receive the firearm can be shipped to the receiving FFL. No mess no fuss.

The best deal going for someone interested in collecting firearms of the WWII period is the C&R license also official known as a Collector of Curios and Relics FFL. These are $30 for three years and all you need is a clean record to obtain one from BATF.

You will have to follow some rules such as keeping a record of your acquistions and dispositions of firearms. No big deal, most collectors I know do this any way whether or not they have a C&R or not. Now some folks will try to scare you off of this saying now ATF can come to you house any time to inspect your collection, guys, they can do that even if you don't have a C&R all they have to do is get a search warrant which is not hard to do. The only C&R licensees I have ever heard of having an inspection have been those that through shaky/illegal deals brought attention to themselves. With the C&R you can buy C&R eligible firearms out of state just as a dealer would and you can ship them to any one else with an FFL all for just $30 every three years. However just to be clear you cannot be engaged in business with a C&R, you can buy and sell to enhance your collection but not as a business.

Yes, even WWII automatic weapons are covered by a C&R as long as they are all original. You still have to go through the Form 4 process but with a C&R you do not have to go through a Class III dealer in most states these firearms can be shipped directly to you.

If anyone has any questions about C&Rs and FFLs feel free to send a PM.

[RKarum]

To make sure that I have read this right...

I, a non licensed gun dealer, can sell only to someone who holds a FFL. I can ship through US Mail, FedEx, DHL and UPS with proper documentation.

I must receive a copie of the dealers information before shipment takes place along with total payment.

I can only mail to the regestered dealers address shown on the license.

Have I missed anything?

Thanks for the information form all who have answered. It looks confusing but it is pretty clear and easy if I understand it right...Rob.

[scotty1418]

As I understand it, you don't need a license to ship it via USPS, just the receiver has to have one CnR or FFL as I understand it.

[CH47]

To make sure that I have read this right...

I, a non licensed gun dealer, can sell only to someone who holds a FFL. I can ship through US Mail, FedEx, DHL and UPS with proper documentation.

I must receive a copie of the dealers information before shipment takes place along with total payment.

I can only mail to the regestered dealers address shown on the license.

Have I missed anything?

Thanks for the information form all who have answered. It looks confusing but it is pretty clear and easy if I understand it right...Rob.

Rob,

All looks correct to me. Long guns only through the USPS for a non licensee.
One other thing, this has nothing to do with ATF but with UPS regulations. The UPS Store cannot accept firearm shipments, these must go to the UPS terminal office for shipping.

JK

[zinfull]

This is confusing and I have done this before.

If you want to sell your guns you can sell them to any one you want. If they are C&R then you can send them to a person who has a C&R license. If they are modern you have to send it to a FFL01 dealer. You do not need a FFL01 or FFL03 license to send firearms. You do need a copy of their license prior to shipping. Some states have extra laws so be careful.

The shippers are a different story. If it is a handgun a FFL01 can ship it by USPS for about $15. At FedEx it will cost a private party about $40-45. If a FFL01 is willing to ship the gun for you and only charge $10 + cost then I would go that way every time.

Jerry

[RKarum]

I think my question(s) have been answered. I will try to list a rifle later to see what happens but I will inquire at the PO, UPS, FedEx and DHL before anything gets under way, just to make sure that all my ducks are in their rows.
I want to shout out a big THANKS to all who have replied to my question, especially CH 47 and Mudsharkangler.

Thanks again...Rob

[Josh Beckett]

As I understand it, you don't need a license to ship it via USPS, just the receiver has to have one CnR or FFL as I understand it.

Recievers are FFL, not C&R. A firearm must be in its original configuration to be counted as a C&R, like a yugo SKS without a grenade launcher(if its not a regular M59) is not C&R.

[CH47]

Recievers are FFL, not C&R. A firearm must be in its original configuration to be counted as a C&R, like a yugo SKS without a grenade launcher(if its not a regular M59) is not C&R.

That is correct. A good example is an M1 Garand, as a whole C&R just the receiver must be shipped by Class 01 FFL. ATF prints a book that lists all firearms that qualify as a C&R. I believe these are free on request from their website.

[CH47]

I think my question(s) have been answered. I will try to list a rifle later to see what happens but I will inquire at the PO, UPS, FedEx and DHL before anything gets under way, just to make sure that all my ducks are in their rows.
I want to shout out a big THANKS to all who have replied to my question, especially CH 47 and Mudsharkangler.

Thanks again...Rob

Rob,

You are more than welcome. If you have any further questions dealing with FFL's please feel free to send a PM.

Jim

[ChrisCook]

Guns

Just to add a bit...I have shipped out over a dozen guns in the past year or so while thinning out my collection.

FEDEX and UPS will ship, but only overnight delivery, so the costs are much higher in my experience. But, these are the only carriers that will accept a pistol, the post office only takes long guns.

USPS is best for a long gun. I always include a photocopy of the FFL or C&R holder that I am shipping to in the package. Many times the post office clerks are clueless. Don't count on them knowing firearms laws/shipping regs. I usually don't even tell them what is in the package, I also typically remove the bolt and wrap it in bubblewrap within the package.

Gunbroker.com offers a complete tutorial on "gun selling", also have links to state by state laws, and also has a link to the BATF to verify an FFL license as being legit.

Hope that helps with the great info already given... Chris...

Completely off topic, but......
Just as a tidbit, if you are ever traveling with gun parts....BATF classifies the receiver as being the firearm. But, TSA has different regs. I had a couple parts kits in my checked luggage and TSA flipped out, according to them I was smuggling a gun... Although I had no receiver with any of my parts kits.....It took awhile to explain that to them and set things straight....

[james m]

Quote:
"USPS is best for a long gun. I always include a photocopy of the FFL or C&R holder that I am shipping to in the package. Many times the post office clerks are clueless. Don't count on them knowing firearms laws/shipping regs. I usually don't even tell them what is in the package, I also typically remove the bolt and wrap it in bubblewrap within the package. "

I totally agree with this quote from the post above. For this reason I quit telling the clerks at USPS that I'm shipping a firearm a long time ago. If some one gets curious there's a copy of my license inside anyway ..
Jim

[CH47]

FEDEX and UPS will ship, but only overnight delivery, so the costs are much higher in my experience. But, these are the only carriers that will accept a pistol, the post office only takes long guns.

Unless there has been a change this week UPS will ship long guns standard ground, they do not have to be sent overnight. That is how we ship all long guns out of the shop, I hate having to go to the post office for anything other than picking up mail.

The post office will accept handguns if the shipment is between FFL dealers. They will not accept hand guns from C&Rs.

If you get into NFA firearms the USPS is the only shipper that will allow them.