Transitional Henckels SS dagger for review.

[Jelle M.]

Hello guys,

can i have some opinions about this dagger?

Thanx in advance

[Jelle M.]

more

[Serge M.]

Looks good, doesn't it. However, IMO, it's a fake. I believe it to be a Czech product.

JMO- Others may have different opinion.


-wagner-

[F J STEPHENS]

Czech ss dagger ?

OK Wags - you have delivered your wisdom:

Looks good, doesn't it. However, IMO, it's a fake. I believe it to be a Czech product.

Now why don't you follow up your pronouncement with some evidence? Please demonstrate why this piece is ACTUALLY A FAKE - in fact please reveal the evidence which confirms that it has emanated from the Czech Republic.

You have made similar pronouncements in the past on this WAF site - and destroyed some collectors' dreams - so would you please back up your "IMHO - In my humble opinion" assertion with some solid evidence which can be researched and checked - surely this it is not too much to be asked?

The collecting community is confused enough; without experts like yourself who make sweeping pronouncements of definitive "knowledge" - yet fail to explain why their knowledge can be relied upon.

I will look forward to your explanation.

Frederick J. Stephens

[MrMiler]

hi

I'm definitly no expert, but it looks to be that the SS-runes on the grip are a bit to "fat" and close to each other.
I don't think they should touch the outher yellow ring either.

RZM code on blade is ok, but not sure about the blade overall.

Wait for better experts.

MrMiler.

[zozole]

Its a bad dagger...

Everything is fake sorry.

If you are interested in ss daggers you should buy some reference books.

Emil

[lucabrnroma]

I'm unexpert too..but also for me the dagger is suspect...more pics would help but hte runes too fat,the etchings seem "light" ...the grip seems brand new and the blade doesn't seem to show the right crossgrain...that's only my poor opinion

[JohnZ]

The cross graining struck me as odd...

John

[mattty]

Although it looks bad, I beleave this to be the controversial Henckels SS dagger type.

Certainly there is major lack of quality and workmanship, but we know that already.

The experts will argue they are 100% original.

These always sell less than other makers.

[Serge M.]

Why Hello Frederick, been on a long vacation?

So I destroyed some collectors 'dreams' ?
>>You have made similar pronouncements in the past on this WAF site - and destroyed some collectors' dreams <<

Wow Fred, I disagree. I know I'm not perfect, my record clearly shows that I actually helped many a collector destroy what would have been their nightmare. One recently on a Full Rohm SS on estand. Guess you didn't see that. Go find it, I won't provide a link for you.

Now, as I stated this dagger IMO is a complete fake. It's fake because I have had both authentic and this type of reproduction 'In Hand' to examine.

1. The blades are reproductions. On these versions, I call the Czech fakes, they can't get the white color of the steel correct as they did in Solingen. So they have a blue/grey tint that's in the steel.
2. The grip is a repro, as when examined it does not have the pore structure of known authentic example of Henckels 1938 & 1939 SS grips.
3. The SS runes are repro (clearly everyone has to see that as they are not even the better fakes.)
4. The eagle, although not a clear shot of it, I'm familiar with it. It's a newly made fake. But not a fake of known type eagle but a hybrid of 'Long Neck' and 'Upward Pointed Beak' versions.
5. The blade company logos are very light and are either Laser etched or photo etched. How you can tell on this supposed 'mint' dagger is the ridge line quickly starts to wear through the logo.
6. The clip hanger is fake. Has a wrong shape compared to period originals.
7. NONE....of these daggers have a real traceable provenance older than 12 years.

So Fred, Perhaps I'm mistaken. So Please state why, and point out features that make this dagger 'good'. Is this example by chance yours ?

-wagner-

[nickn]

Why Hello Frederick, been on a long vacation?

So I destroyed some collectors 'dreams' ?
>>You have made similar pronouncements in the past on this WAF site - and destroyed some collectors' dreams <<

Wow Fred, I disagree. I know I'm not perfect, my record clearly shows that I actually helped many a collector destroy what would have been their nightmare. One recently on a Full Rohm SS on estand. Guess you didn't see that. Go find it, I won't provide a link for you.

Now, as I stated this dagger IMO is a complete fake. It's fake because I have had both authentic and this type of reproduction 'In Hand' to examine.

1. The blades are reproductions. On these versions, I call the Czech fakes, they can't get the white color of the steel correct as they did in Solingen. So they have a blue/grey tint that's in the steel.
2. The grip is a repro, as when examined it does not have the pore structure of known authentic example of Henckels 1938 & 1939 SS grips.
3. The SS runes are repro (clearly everyone has to see that as they are not even the better fakes.)
4. The eagle, although not a clear shot of it, I'm familiar with it. It's a newly made fake. But not a fake of known type eagle but a hybrid of 'Long Neck' and 'Upward Pointed Beak' versions.
5. The blade company logos are very light and are either Laser etched or photo etched. How you can tell on this supposed 'mint' dagger is the ridge line quickly starts to wear through the logo.
6. The clip hanger is fake. Has a wrong shape compared to period originals.
7. NONE....of these daggers have a real traceable provenance older than 12 years.

So Fred, Perhaps I'm mistaken. So Please state why, and point out features that make this dagger 'good'. Is this example by chance yours ?

-wagner-

I agree with all of the above just look at the colour of the steel with laser etched motto and trade mark
These Czech fakes were discussed in length on gg a few years back
A member was selling one of these for a Czech lady called "sylvie" who some of you might have heard of he got quite nasty when it was outed

[Tiger 1]

The cross grain is too coarse.. Incorrect grit was used . Too matt a finish.
The rest of the dagger? Not for me, thanks.
Tony

[dutchdrummer]

Although it looks bad, I beleave this to be the controversial Henckels SS dagger type.

Certainly there is major lack of quality and workmanship, but we know that already.

The experts will argue they are 100% original.

These always sell less than other makers.

I think you mean Helbig SS daggers, not Henckels.

[Mac 66]

First thing i saw was that Grey blade with crappy looking crossgrain

not to mention that shiney new grip with fat SS runes


certainly not a one looker origional




Mac 66.

[mattty]

I think you mean Helbig SS daggers, not Henckels.

I stand corrected dutchdrummer, I beleave it was the helbig transitionals which were abit touch and go.