Two tone color heer grip

[Anton]

I see theard about DRK dagger. And start this theard about my two tone color dagger.
Thanks for looking.

[Anton]

Close

[Anton]

Alcoso

[Serge M.]

Nice early Alcoso. Congrats.

-wagner-

[Anton]

Nice early Alcoso. Congrats.

-wagner-

Tanks !!!

[heers68]

Nicely toned orange grip! I would disagree with Wags a bit on the period, I would think this is a mid period Alcoso since this has the "Alcoso" in script. This also has the Generic "B" fittings on the dagger hilt that is seen (not very often!) on later Alcoso's. Nice condition overall, Congrats!! Kevin.

[Anton]

Thanks !
Regards Anton

[fdodge]

Nice dagger. The 2-tone grip is interesting. I have a Voos with 2 tones also.

Regards,
Frank

[Br. James]

An interesting artifact! I am not a collector of military sidearms and have not studied this area of TR collecting, but I do recall an article I read some while ago on the subject of colored grips often found on Heer Daggers and occasionally on Luftwaffe Daggers...though seldom on Kriegsmarine Daggers. Such grips, assumedly all of bakelite material, range in color from off-white to light yellow to bright lemon yellow to various shades of orange...such as the two sides of the dagger in question here. The article's author was asserting the idea that all of these daggers were originally created to include white grips, but that over the decades, some grips have aged into the various colors seen today. I don't recall what the author attributed this odd and uneven process to -- perhaps exposure or non-exposure to light or smoking combined with the materials used to make the grips, or perhaps the core material (wood?) interacting with the plastic over time...?? If this was the case, then perhaps Anton's two-tone grip is a normal example of exposure to various conditions over the years? Any thoughts or comments from those more experienced in this area of our hobby? Many thanks,

Br. James

[Anton]

Hello all !
I have a question about grossguard. I think it's correct for alcoso. But some guy tell me that's is not alcoso. But on this reference link i see another dagger wih this type of grossguard http://www.heeresdolch.de/html/a__coppel_alcoso.html
Please give me your option&

[DaveR]

just my opinion but i never agreed with the idea all grips started out white and then changed color. a good example are the many nice white grips on daggers in all different conditions, some pretty rusty. yet the poor lives they had did not change the white grip to anything but a dirty white. i have had a minty Eickhorn heer dagger that still has most of the clear coat on the fittings, with a nice dark pumpkin color grip. it has been the same for the 35 years i have had it. i have had many white grip daggers that never changed color. i'd like to see even one example that was pictured over time showing any color change from light to dark. the sun will fade dark to light, but not vise versa, in most cases.

[Frogprince]

Molded Bakelite (phenolic resin) could not be made in light colors because of the heat and pressure involved in the manufacturing process. So the Germans (who BTW were period leaders in dyestuffs) made them using a cast phenolic resin that had different names and slight variations depending on the maker (also being made outside Germany). But one with a fatal flaw that was never overcome - although some batches/formulas were less susceptible to color changes than others. With the primary culprit being ultraviolet light which was used as a standard test for new resin formulas (there was a 90% failure rate).

With wood or plaster cored white celluloid grips an alternative often seen for example on Naval daggers. With celluloid not nearly as susceptible to color changes. Likewise, the milk based resin grips were not as susceptible to color changes, but they had their own kinds of problems. And black Bakelite itself (painted white) seen with still other daggers. With the two tone effect observed on daggers mounted on walls with one side out for a long period of time. Or in other cases, a two tone effect where a knot was wrapped around the grip protecting it from sunlight. Fred

[Vaughan]

About your x guard. kevin has stated the facts correctly above. The guard is a generic type not manufactured by ACS. Due to occasional material shortages most if not all manufacturers who made their own fittings did at some time or another use those from other producers or the commonly referred to generic A & B types.

As always Fred is also absolutely correct. The matter is frequently raised but the debate is well and truly over.