Teno Dagger Measurements

[DJDR]

Im exhausted with the Teno Theory

The more I read, the more I question ever buying any new daggers. I have a Teno listed on another site as "To the Experts--How is this Teno" Well , I ask the question again to all that have replied to Craigs thread. Is it real, and what type of value would you put on it? Thanks for your help

[ww2germanhelmet]

First, I want to commend Craig for a well thought out presentation on these two daggers. Based on the evidence presented, I am quite sure that both are 100% correct. The only real question is why is the first example un-burnished. All elements of the scabbard are correct otherwise. As in all aspects of the hobby, unexplained anomalies occur. And I do agree that the provenance is very important. Sure, we should never blindly assume that everything that comes fresh from a Vet estate or family is 100% authentic, however, I can tell you that when you interact with the family during the process, you can gain a certain amount of confidence about the authenticity of an item. I have been fortunate enough to score some tremendous items direct from Vet families, and some have been extremely rare that broke from traditionally held collector views. An open mind and common sense will always be important to the hobby moving forward. Just my humble two cents fellows.

Dave

[Craig Gottlieb]

I would certainly value it at less than a "completed" dagger (one with the burnishing). My best guess as to why there was no burnishing, is that it was simply never issued, and left the factory as a war souvenir. All the dagger experts who stopped by at SOS to look at the dagger had no doubts as to its originality, and my theory was the consensus as well.

[dr01]

DJDR, I wouldn't worry about your dagger. I have no doubt it is 100% original.

Danny

[dave peifer]

i have made this statement before,but i think it can be repeated.........one has to do their own research and be satisfied with an items authenticity,you can take almost any item to a show and ask 6 people their opinion and get several different opinions.........dave

[Frogprince]

“Burnishing” is an interesting use of the word. Especially by dagger collectors usually to describe a black coloration on metal. With in ordinary exposure to the atmosphere, neither nickel or zinc normally developing a black patination. But silver and silver bearing alloys do, and over the years I’ve seen various daggers and swords with a cold process applied silver finish to make them into “SS” sabers. Or maybe a “High Leader’s” or some other kind of dagger. And with some additional processing a brand new finish can be made to look like it took years to develop the black patination. Which is NOT - I repeat NOT - that I am suggesting that the scabbards were silver plated.

.................. My best guess as to why there was no burnishing, is that it was simply never issued, and left the factory as a war souvenir. All the dagger experts who stopped by at SOS to look at the dagger had no doubts as to its originality, and my theory was the consensus as well.

That may be - but I would imagine that what they saw at the SOS was a dagger with a pommel that looked like this.



Which I found fairly interesting because when it was first posted it seemed to look more like it does below. With more of a black patination on the top of the roundels instead of less - and with what seemed to be flatter tops not rounded.




So if I understand the point being made the dagger was judged to be a postwar souvenir made up out of parts? Which seems to have somehow changed its outward appearance from point A to point B(?). FP

[Craig Gottlieb]

Frog Prince is right. "Burnishing" is not the correct term at all. Darkening of the type found on badges, or on the Teno, should be called "Artificial Patina" or something to that effect. Burnishing involves the brushing of certain or all of the parts of something, to bring out a different finish. He is incorrect that this was deemed a post-war souvenir made of parts. It was deemed identical in EVERY respect to any other TeNo, except that the "burnishing" is absent.

[Hoss]

Frog Prince is right. "Burnishing" is not the correct term at all. Darkening of the type found on badges, or on the Teno, should be called "Artificial Patina" or something to that effect. Burnishing involves the brushing of certain or all of the parts of something, to bring out a different finish. He is incorrect that this was deemed a post-war souvenir made of parts. It was deemed identical in EVERY respect to any other TeNo, except that the "burnishing" is absent.

Thank you FP for the post
Craig
Are all the experts who examined this dagger members here, did Mr Stephens see it?

Eric

[Frogprince]

"Frog Prince .................. is incorrect that this was deemed a post-war souvenir made of parts. It was deemed identical in EVERY respect to any other TeNo, except that the "burnishing" is absent."

I can’t speak to what the “dagger experts” did or saw. But I was surprised that there was no mention of a dagger pommel that has obviously been fooled around with - and that none of them had seen or commented on some big pieces of the original nickel plating that are missing. Something that is more consistent with a well worn component that has been abused. So I was preparing a couple of images of what: “any other TeNo” dagger pommel looks like - as compared to the dagger that is the main topic. And that is when I reexamined an image that I think saves me the effort of trying to explain the obvious.

"A recent thread wherein this dagger's authenticity was questioned, prompted me to do a comparative study between the dagger in question ............."

Why is the pommel covered up in the photo? Was that what started this thread where the dagger's authenticity was called into question earlier?? FP

[Craig Gottlieb]

Obvious to you, but not to anybody who saw it, funny that.

[Hoss]

Thanks FP
This thread is worse than suffering with a tooth abscess.
Good luck with your dagger Craig.

I'll continue to study these beautiful daggers when time permits, always liked them.

Life is too short

Regards
Eric