Black Handeled SA Dagger

[william15]

Hello,
Im looking for information regarding the dagger I have posted, and its approximate value. Some say NSKK and others Marine SA. Any help is much appreciated.
Regards
William

[william15]

Black Handeled SA Dagger

2

[william15]

Black Handeled SA Dagger

3

[william15]

Black Handeled SA Dagger

4

[R.R.]

Seems to me this black handle is a post war creation, none SA dagger was originally black wood made.

[Nimble1]

Early NSKK?

I have read that some of the early NSKK folks painted the scabbards and grips black . Thats a possible explanation. And the grip looks original.

[JONATHAN]

Looks original to me, I have handled a few of these over the years. Your problem is the wear to the piece will not help the value.

[JamesUS]

Looks like an original grip, appears that at some point in time, grip was sanded down and stained a dark ebony, sanded again, re stained ect so that the stain permeated the wood.
The original underlying wood color appears to be coming out in the center of the grip, the area it was handled the most, and subject to the most wear.

Whether this was period done is impossible to tell, my guess would be no, as non standard procedures done to regulation weapons was not exactly encouraged in the TR, or any military/paramilitary organization.
Its easy to imagine that an SS man encountering an SA man with such a modified weapon would want to throttle him, and would be justified in doing so.

[ivbaust]

There are some opinions that these black SA daggers belonged to the SA Marine. However, I´ve seen no evidence until today that this is true. Most likely these are NSKK daggers, which have been painted or stained black by the owners. It may have happened due to a misunderstanding of the order when the Motor SA has been integrated into the NSKK and the former brown SA daggers of the Motor SA had to be changed into black SA daggers for the NSKK. Instead of painting / staining the scabbard black only, they painted / stained also the grip black.

Here´s another one of these black SA daggers made by Pack.

[777]

There are some opinions that these black SA daggers belonged to the SA Marine. However, I´ve seen no evidence until today that this is true. Most likely these are NSKK daggers, which have been painted or stained black by the owners. It may have happened due to a misunderstanding of the order when the Motor SA has been integrated into the NSKK and the former brown SA daggers of the Motor SA had to be changed into black SA daggers for the NSKK. Instead of painting / staining the scabbard black only, they painted / stained also the grip black.

I second that, but must add the wood of the discussed dagger looks very similar to original SS grips.

[reichenberg]

I have just seen this dagger come up for sale on a UK dealers website and I'm tempted, but unsure!

[RevYJ]

I posted this on a similar thread but it didn't get much notice. I've recently acquired an original 1937 Organisationsbuch der NSDAP that was issued to NSKK Motor Standarte 55 of Stuttgart. One of the color illustrations shows a Marinesturmfuhrer and Marinescharfuhrer in full regulation uniform. The daggers very clearly have black scabbards and grips.

[777]

Very interesting, thanks for sharing. Many people are sceptical about those Marine daggers, since there is no official regulation document from the 3R period talking about "black" SA daggers. Here we have some kind of a proof.