Opinions needed on Trench/Fight Knife

[sb98]

In the late Ninetee´s many of WW I fighting-knives were sold in Germany by a large dealer.

This knives came out of an "discovered arsenal" ...

There´re different maker´s like ERN, Demag, Köller, ...

The price for one of these knives each: Deutsch-Mark 198,--

Experienced collector´s are knowing today, that this knives never ever were made before 1918.

On the fighting-knife in this thread I do not see any sign´s of the decades.
This knife´s looks like, it was made yesterday ...

I saw the pic´s and by my own I know, this is not a genuine WWI-item.

Regard´s,

Reibert

Hi Reibert,

I've heard people say a big cache was found in Turkey. I think that's the same "discovered arsenal" you mention. What do you mean when you say "this knives never ever were made before 1918"? Do you mean all the unused Demags, ERNs, Köllers, etc. from this cache are fake? The ones I've seen have Imperial inspection marks, so if they're real I would think they were not made after the war.

I wouldn't say Rolv's knife is fake because it looks new. I have several knives in this condition. I can't say for sure, but it looks good to me. It's not the same as the copies all over ebay. The scabbard is original, except for the added symbols.

[Reibert-Austria]

Hi, Tim !

In this thread I already explained, why I think this knife´s isn´t "good" ...

You mentionend a found in Turkey. I heard ´bout this the first time today, thank´s !

I meant the knives, that were offered in Germany in the ninety´s as "Arsenal-Fund". From wich country, they didn´t say ...

This knives were sold out soon.
During the last year´s more and more were asked for authenticity and were compared with "secured" findings.

Some of the "Arsenal" pieces were made "well", other´s not ...

The acceptance-marks were often made also very "well".

Otherwise the acceptance-marks were stamped on the false side of the blade on many of this knives.

So, ...


Regard´s,

Reibert

P.S.:
Please, could you show us some of the "ebay-copy´s" ?

[sb98]

Hi Reipert,

The fakes you talk about from the "arsenal find" - do you know which makers were faked? Do you have pictures of any of these?

Here is the fake Gottlieb I see the most on ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/GERMAN-FIGHTING-...QQcmdZViewItem). The blade and maker markers are "soft" looking. The scabbard is bad too. I'm not saying Rolv's is ok, but it's not the same as the common fakes that are all over the place. The quality (crispness of the marks and crossgraining) of his looks ok to me.

Here's another similar fake http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=138023

And one sold as a repro on a website http://www.historicalweaponsstore.co...nch-knife.html

[Reibert-Austria]

I already mentioned some of the maker´s in this thread.

Also in this "Arsenal-Find" there´re found knives out of "neutral manufacturing of unknown maker´s in Solingen with different wooden grips and different blade-design" ...

Also the dealer wrote:
All the blade´s are extremly sharpened and this is a sign, that these knives never have been in use ...

Again: so ...

I´m user in the largest German-speaking Militaria-Forum:

http://militaria-fundforum.de/index.php

There you can find some fakes of such knives.

[phild]

Hi Reibert,

I've heard people say a big cache was found in Turkey. I think that's the same "discovered arsenal" you mention. What do you mean when you say "this knives never ever were made before 1918"? Do you mean all the unused Demags, ERNs, Köllers, etc. from this cache are fake? The ones I've seen have Imperial inspection marks, so if they're real I would think they were not made after the war.

I wouldn't say Rolv's knife is fake because it looks new. I have several knives in this condition. I can't say for sure, but it looks good to me. It's not the same as the copies all over ebay. The scabbard is original, except for the added symbols.

Tim, You are correct in what you say above. Plenty of 100% original and near mint pre Nov 1918 trench knives were found and sold as you describe..actually starting about 22+ years ago in Germany and it took a few years after that for some numbers to reach the US dealers.

Having said that, there are some very good copies of many of the variations of these knives around, but IMO if you know a bit about these knives the copies will not be problem.....they are NO where near as close as say SS skulls or kinghts crosses to making these as great fakes.