Ernst Pack & Son Partially Erased Rohm

[LDR]

I recently bought this partially erased Rohm, and would like some expert views on it.

The dagger has a nice light wooden grip, not quite a blonde, but still nice. Both sets of crossguards fit tight and show signs of dirt and verdi gres.

Pommel is tight with no spanner marks. SA button and grip eagle are perfect.

Lower crossguard is Gau marked 'He'.

The front of the blade is nice with around 95% crossgrain, 99% burnishing in the motto. There is slight greying and the usual in out marks, but altogether a nice looking front.

The reverse is also nice with around 80% crossgraining. The Rohm name has been crudely erased/filed off, leaving signs of the top of the letters of the name. This erasing has also slightly caught the end of the dedication, and top of the markers mark, which is EP&S.

I know there are fake version of EP&S but i cant remember what the obvious signs are. Isnt a small '&' a sign of a fake? This is hard to see on this piece though as the erasing has gone through the '&'.

The scabbard also has a slight gap of around 1mm where it meets with the crossguard, however only on the front. There is a slight gap on the reverse but only on one side. See the pictures below.

Signs of scabbard anodizing and lacquer are visible front and back, with some slight rusting to the front.

So, can people please give there views on the maker mark, the dedication and the slight gap in scabbard to crossguard fit.

Any views on this dagger would be much appriciated.

Thanks

LDR

[LDR]

Can anyone give some views on this please?

Thanks

lewis

[pvluger]

There could be something going on internally in the scabbard. I feel this is probably the original scabbard, but I suppose it could be an old match up(not likely). The rest looks good to me.

[LDR]

Thanks PVluger.

Any info on the fake EPS logos?

[pvluger]

I can see that you have excellent crossgrain matching up to the logo. This would be rather difficult IMO to replicate on an original blade over a different logo. Even if the blade was completely bogus, how on earth would the accomplish the exact factory grain+ perfect fit? Your example looks pretty unmessed with.

[dag001]

Do you happen to know the provenance of this dagger? Was it in the U.S. at one time?
In the 1960's I vet-acquired a partially ground Röhm with no scabbard. I hate to admit it, but at that time we didn't know any better and didn't hesitate to add or replace parts to upgrade a dagger. I think this was true of most collectors back them. Fortunately, I had enough sense to add an anodised scabbard from another EP&S dagger. Back then SA daggers were literally coming out of the woodwork from veterans. My rough guess is that I have owned nearly 200 of them over the years.
The grinding on your dagger and the light handle color looks exactly like the one I owned and later sold in the 1970's. It also seems like the crossguard on mine was He marked but can no longer remember with certainty. I remember the scabbard being in a bit better condition than what you show, but that could also be the result of poor storage in the last 30 years. At any rate, I feel about 70% certain this is the same dagger. If so, this could possibly account for the gap between the scabbard and crossguard.

[LDR]

Denny, yes this dagger came from the US.

Funny thing is if the dagger is put in the wrong way round it fits ok. So i dont know if this means the scabbard liners have been taken out and put in the wrong way round. I know it shouldnt make a difference, but this maybe the problem.

lewis

[dag001]

Hi Lewis,
I have no way of knowing for sure if this is the dagger I once owned. I sold mine in 1971 for the princely sum of $90.00 because I was building a new house. Ah yes! The good old days....

[LDR]

I paid alot more than $90, i can tell you that!