Kabelkarte (cable maps)

[Leif-Tore]

Hello

I have some cable maps, which have some abbreviations that I don't know.
Hope someone here can help me.

These examples are from a battery With six 15 cm K16 guns.

Handm. R. IV - This is somewhere on or near a gun emplacement. Perhaps the room where Shells and grenades where put together? Or the shelter room?

Zugf. Leitst - This is the fire Control bunker for Three of six guns, but what does Zugf. mean?

H. Muni. R. IV - Is this the ammunition bunker, or could it be the same as Handm. R. IV?

Stand 5xx - Different numbers used, 508, 513, 521 and 522. Would these be other bunkers? Barracks? There are also the Stand 13 KwK. The KwK is obvious, but Stand?

For some reason I am not allowed to attached some examples from the original cable maps (or anything else, for that matter). Maybe someone can tell me why I'm not allowed to attach anything?

Hope someone can help me.

Best regards,

Leif-Tore

[Funksammler]

Only members can post pictures directly, as a non member (like most of us on here) you can however post a link from an external picture host like Imgur.

Handm. probably stands for Handmunition; this is where they kept their rifle and mg ammunition and hand grenades etc.

Zugf. Leitst. probably stands for Zugführer Leitstelle or platoon commander's command post

A "Stand" is literally a standing place, usually a bunker of platform for a heavy weapon. These are the main fighting bunkers. So an MG-stand is typically a Tobruk for a machine gun. The KwK stand is a Tobruk fitted with a Kampfwagenkanone, typically a tank turret taken from a French tank or another outdated fighting vehicle.

regards,

Funksammler

[Leif-Tore]

Thanks Funksammler!

Your answer is basically the same as what I thought, but I was not sure.

I'm still wondering about one of the KwK Stands.
There are no signs of any concrete within the cable length range, from the start point. Also no signs on old aerial photoes, or on original maps dated february 1945. But there was a KwK further away, but then there has to be a typing error several Places on the same cable map, which doesn't sound likely?

On another "Übersichts-kabelplan" there some other terms used.
ÜEV (KA) and Schaltstein (KV).
Any ideas?

The reason for these questions is that I am trying to find out where the different functions/units where located, based on cable lenghts from the cable maps.
The Nachrichten-bunker is about to be restored in some degree, and we would like to have as much information as possible about what Connections there was to/from this bunker, and what was located where. The area is being converted back to Farmland, so a lot of stuff will dissappear in the near future.

The bunker has got 6 antenna niches, and there has been 4 or 5 KEV's.

If anyone have any photoes from a nachriften-bunker, please show them to me.

Best regards,

Leif-Tore

[Funksammler]

It is worth remembering that not everything planned was actually built. Cabling would have gone in at the early stages of construction, so it could be that the KWK stand was planned but not built. Especially after it became clear that the Normandy landings were the "main event", construction of the Atlantic wall in other places was scaled down.

Difficult to be sure about the abbreviations without context. KA and KV could be "Kabelanschluß" and "Kabelverteiler" respectively. Sometimes the "Kabelverteiler" were buried or placed in concrete pits underground, indicated by a stone marker on the surface, this could reference to the "Schaltstein". the ÜEV could be a "Übererdischer EndVerschluß", a connecting box in trench to tie in a FF33 into the network.

regards,

Funksammler

[Leif-Tore]

Thanks again Funksammler!

The maps are dated 6.2.44, but still, it could be planned and not built.
Maybe I'll find someone With a metaldetector, and try to trace the cables.

I think you are right about KA and KV. It makes sense when I look at different maps With these terms used.

There is another one that is written With a pencil, and is a bit blurred, but I think it says K.Ü.V.
Does this ring any bell?

Best regards,

Leif-Tore

[Funksammler]

Not sure, could be Kabel Übergangs Verteiler (a connection box where two different cable types were connected e.g FESTA ad FESTI cable. It seems the abbreviations are non-official, just used by the particular design and construction group (probably an OT unit).

regards,

Funksammler

[F.Knieriemen]

IMHO
Zugf Leits. Most likely it’s „Zugführer Leitstelle“
Stand refers most likely to „Standort“, Location Position
... rest was already addressed

[Leif-Tore]

Thank you F.Knieriemen and Remco!

Had a trip out there the other day. Could not trace any cables, but found a cablestone marked F.
Normally the cablestones (at least the ones I have seen) are marked for instance like --- or _/ to show the direction of the cable, and if the cable turns in another direction.

Where there any system, where different letters ment different Things, or where they just marked A, B, C, and so on?
I have seen one With M (or W?) on before, but discussed it locally, and was told that it meant "Messpunkt". Is this correct?

On the overview cable map, there is a F, but it is marked as a bunker, and is more than 1,5 km away.

Best regards,

Leif-Tore

[Funksammler]

The manual does give a number of standard symbols for "Kabelmarksteine" (with stripes, corners etc showing the direction of the cable), but it does say that these are only applied when secrecy of the cable runs is not an issue. In defensive positions that could be infiltrated by the enemy, the cables were not marked in the field but only kept on the "Kabellageplan". The exact position of the cables would have to be established with the cable detector.

Locally, other "Markstein" systems may have been used but without a legend we can only guess at its meaning.

To prevent accidental damage during digging activities, a 20 cm red plastic strip was buried over of the cable. In this respect not much has changed as this is still industrial practice.

regards,

Funksammler

[Leif-Tore]

Thanks again, Remco!

What is the name/number of the manual that you refer to?
Have you got it, and if so, are you willing to share it With me?

Best regards,

Leif-Tore

[Funksammler]

D796 Handbuch der Fernsprecher und Signalanlagen in Festungen. I'll send you a PM...

regards,

Funksammler

[Val]

D796 Handbuch der Fernsprecher und Signalanlagen in Festungen. I'll send you a PM...

FS - do you have now a complete one or it this the same i know?

[Funksammler]

It is the abridged version....

regards,

Funksammler

[F.Knieriemen]

Investigating in the Westwall telephone network - i‘d be very much interested in this manual too

In our Museum we have such Markstein...

Cheers Fritze

[Val]

It is the abridged version....

OK, it's the same version we both know. If you manage to get a full version, let me know.

i‘d be very much interested in this manual too

check your e-mail