Greiling & Co. / Felina Tropical Cap

[Hans Dampf]

Hello all,

I am a newcomer to the board and this is my first post. I have been collecting German uniforms and field caps off and on since the seventies, but I am a newcomer to tropical headgear. I recently picked up a Felina tropical cap and have been pouring over various threads trying to better educate myself. The amount of expertise on this forum is amazing to say the least!

The cap is extremely well made. Everything looks, feels, and smells like a period cap. The only doubt I have concerns the grommets. On the outside they are flat around the edges – almost as if the crimping tool had been used with too much force. The fabric has come loose from the grommets in a few places inside and out (which I find unusual for an unworn cap), and one grommet has no internal keeper.

I bought the cap from a dealer whom I consider trustworthy, and I can still return it if need be.

My main concern is: real or fake / pre or post 1945?

Any opinions?

Cheers,
Hans

[OSS]

The cap looks good and it's construction looks right for this maker. PS. the grommets look correct but perhaps sloppily installed.

[Richard T]

I like it also

[msteve21]

Agree with other comments
Msteve

[Tim O'Keefe]

Hello Hans & welcome to the Forum.

You have done well for your first post and will look forwards to hearing from you more in the future

This caps grommets are interesting. The cap itself looks A' ok and the insignia is originally applied per this maker. The grommets have been reversed. The insides are on the outside etc. Also the washers have been inverted as well (missing in one case) giving a curious appearance. Ok that bits of material infiltrate the grommets. Would like to get a better look at the makers stamp ?

As to original WW2 ? This cap maker has an interesting history. Some unfinished caps were found from this maker post war and then finished. How many, numbers are not known ? Is this unissued cap one of them ?

cheers

Tim

[Hans Dampf]

Thank you all for your replies. My gut feeling was good about this cap, but I have grown cautious in my old age. I think one weakness we as collectors all share is that we want a new acquisition to be "all right," and that can cloud our judgement. A second opinion is always a good idea.

Tim, I will post two photos of the maker's stamp, one taken with flash and one without. I got as close as my camera would allow.

From what I have been able to find on the internet, Richard Greiling bought Felina in the 1930s, but the company’s main office was (and still is) in Mannheim. I haven’t been able to find any information on a subsidiary in Frankfurt, but a lot of records were destroyed in the war. And most companies involved in wartime production would rather forget that chapter in their history. 90th Light has posted some good research on Felina here on the board.

Thanks again to all,
Hans

[RGD51]

Original cap with minor manufacturers anomalies, no biggee. Has a very nice classic profile and scallop upturn that many dont have. Displays well.

Robt.

[90th Light]

From what I have been able to find on the internet, Richard Greiling bought Felina in the 1930s, but the company’s main office was (and still is) in Mannheim. I haven’t been able to find any information on a subsidiary in Frankfurt, but a lot of records were destroyed in the war. And most companies involved in wartime production would rather forget that chapter in their history. 90th Light has posted some good research on Felina here on the board.

Thanks again to all,
Hans

Greiling/ Felina is a fascinating German WW2 tropical cap manufacturer to study.

There are 100% original tropical caps made and distributed by them during the war. But there are also work in progress found unfinished in factory bins, and completed for sale after the war ended. Both types exhibit Greiling/ Felina manufacturer's footprints such as shape, cut, sewing and the way the insignia is applied.

Another interesting identification for both types, is the tropical eagles and especially the tropical cockades used. They are from the same wartime manufacturer on both Greiling/ Felina made during the war before May 1945 and the examples finished off after WW2 ended. It would appear that a lot of the work in progress found was near the stage of a finished cap with the badges already in place.

As far as your example is concerned, based on the images provided it looks to be a nice wartime completed 2nd model with sweatband. Typical of what Greiling/ Felina made before May 1945.

Have a look at this example on Virtual Grenadier to see a nice wartime made first model with soutache; https://www.virtualgrenadier.com/sale_item.php?iid=5475. Note the stamps compared with your stamps.

A wartime completed first model M40 by Greiling/ Felina is harder find than a second model. However the manufacturing shape, cut, sewing and grommets are consistent between the two models. The points of difference being the soutache and sweatband.

Original Greiling/ Felina tropical caps made before May 1945 are not that easy to find for sale. Thanks for posting yours,

Chris

[RGD51]

Great info! Any early examples on this forum?

Robt.

[90th Light]

Great info! Any early examples on this forum?

Robt.

The medical soutached Greiling/Felina for sale on Virtual Grenadier is the best example of the first model by Felina that has turned up so far.

I need to go back and now restudy what is shown here on WAF. The reason for doing this is the soutache on the VG one for sale. It is made from a shinny 1942 type Artifical Silk blend with a good percentage of possibly ersatz-cellulose/ ersatz-celluloid or something similar in it. Hence the shine. Some collectors dismiss shinny soutaches as being postwar made from Nylon, which is not correct for certain examples such as seen on some Greiling/ Felina tropical caps

It is my opinion/ experience, Greiling/ Felina did not make tropical M40 caps until 1942. The first tropical M40's they made had soutaches. However, I do not think that many first models made it to the front.

I can only speculate if Greiling/ Felina were in the process of getting their first batches completed when the orders to remove the soutache and stop making caps with soutache came through ? Did Greiling/ Felina then put that first models tropical M40's on hold to remove the soutaches and rework the cap. Is this what was found in the bins after the war ended ?

In my opinion, the soutached cap for sale on the Virtual Grenadier site, is made from the later floppy twill and probably dates from around April/ May 1942 or slightly before. I also know of a veteran brought back second model from Tunisia with sweatband and green soutache cut-off. This second model is made from the earlier stiffer twill and was taken from a soldier in the 90th Light. A second model with sweatband and soutache would have to date from around May 1942.

The third example I know of, is similar to the thread starter. It is also a veteran brought back second model from Tunisia in 1943. It has stiff twill with sweatband but never ever had a soutache.

Hopefully this thread might bring more out of the woodwork or reveal more information about this,

Chris

[Hans Dampf]

Thank you Robt. and Chris for your comments and thoughts. Personally, I find the Felina caps very attractive. They have a classic profile. Hopefully this thread will bring more info and photos to light.

It's hard to say why Felina would have had unfinished caps lying around. Tropical uniforms were also issued to troops in Italy, southern France, Greece (including Crete), and southern Russia (Crimea, etc.), so there certainly would have been a demand for caps well into 1944. Maybe orders were cancelled as the Wehrmacht retreated?

Chris, thank you for posting the link to Virtual Grenadier. A picture is indeed worth a thousand words.

I'll continue digging into Felina, and of course I will post any info I can find.

Cheers,
Hans

[90th Light]

Thank you Robt. and Chris for your comments and thoughts. Personally, I find the Felina caps very attractive. They have a classic profile. Hopefully this thread will bring more info and photos to light.

It's hard to say why Felina would have had unfinished caps lying around. Tropical uniforms were also issued to troops in Italy, southern France, Greece (including Crete), and southern Russia (Crimea, etc.), so there certainly would have been a demand for caps well into 1944. Maybe orders were cancelled as the Wehrmacht retreated?

Chris, thank you for posting the link to Virtual Grenadier. A picture is indeed worth a thousand words.

I'll continue digging into Felina, and of course I will post any info I can find.

Cheers,
Hans

I agree, Greiling/ Felina tropical M40's have a nice high profile and a distinctive but pleasing shape. However, the sewing can be a bit rough in places, especially the application of the badges.

Hard to know why unfinished work in progress tropical caps or parts of caps were left in the factory bins along with the correct tropical eagles, cockades, shiny-soutache and sewing thread ? I have also wondered if the factory's cut-out patterns were found ? I suspect they were not because once the work in progress caps were sold off in the 1980's and 1990's, no more have ever appeared on the market since. Any for sale today are ones that were originally sold back then.

It is a bit like the "Beehive" find. A railway goods carriage full to the brim with finished ready to wear tropical caps dated 1942 or RB numbered, tropical belts and some other tropical items. Gets detached from its train during the war and shunted on to a siding line, to be left untouched until the war is over. You would think someone would have looked inside the goods carriage in late 1943 or 1944 and seen some useful uniforms to be used.

Anyway, I am pleased you found the link to Virtual Grenadier useful and you have no worries about your cap which is a nice example sew up before May 1945

Chris

[RGD51]

The medical soutached Greiling/Felina for sale on Virtual Grenadier is the best example of the first model by Felina that has turned up so far.

I need to go back and now restudy what is shown here on WAF. The reason for doing this is the soutache on the VG one for sale. It is made from a shinny 1942 type Artifical Silk blend with a good percentage of possibly ersatz-cellulose/ ersatz-celluloid or something similar in it. Hence the shine. Some collectors dismiss shinny soutaches as being postwar made from Nylon, which is not correct for certain examples such as seen on some Greiling/ Felina tropical caps

It is my opinion/ experience, Greiling/ Felina did not make tropical M40 caps until 1942. The first tropical M40's they made had soutaches. However, I do not think that many first models made it to the front.

I can only speculate if Greiling/ Felina were in the process of getting their first batches completed when the orders to remove the soutache and stop making caps with soutache came through ? Did Greiling/ Felina then put that first models tropical M40's on hold to remove the soutaches and rework the cap. Is this what was found in the bins after the war ended ?

In my opinion, the soutached cap for sale on the Virtual Grenadier site, is made from the later floppy twill and probably dates from around April/ May 1942 or slightly before. I also know of a veteran brought back second model from Tunisia with sweatband and green soutache cut-off. This second model is made from the earlier stiffer twill and was taken from a soldier in the 90th Light. A second model with sweatband and soutache would have to date from around May 1942.

The third example I know of, is similar to the thread starter. It is also a veteran brought back second model from Tunisia in 1943. It has stiff twill with sweatband but never ever had a soutache.

Hopefully this thread might bring more out of the woodwork or reveal more information about this,

Chris

Interesting mention of the soutache, I thought it was silk too wrapped around a cotton core of course. I believe silk will glow under blacklite if I recall so if encountered should not be dismissed as fake.

Robt.

[Tim O'Keefe]

Thanks for the added photos of the stamps Hans.


Were the partial bits and pieces put together post war to make some complete caps ? The soutache could have been added postwar which would explain the "thin" soutache on a good cap ? Especially if caps were left unfinished it would be easy to add a soutache. Are there any post war put together Felina caps ? If original parts and construction patterns were followed how would one know anyway ?

[90th Light]

Interesting mention of the soutache, I thought it was silk too wrapped around a cotton core of course. I believe silk will glow under blacklite if I recall so if encountered should not be dismissed as fake.

Robt.

Yes, it is my understanding that some Artificial Silks reflect a black light. Depends on the colour. However, the glow is not as strong as you will get from a modern A4 blank piece of white paper for your photocopier.

Another thing that complicates a black light test is if a cap has been washed in a post-war clothes powder with whiteners in it e.g. Persil. If this is the case, then the white ring on a totally original tropical cockade which normally will not glow, will glow quite bright. Same with certain soutache colours like Artificial Silk Pink especially if the inner ersatz-cotton core which the silk is wrapped around is white. Both the white on the cockade and the soutache will glow but not quite as bright as a piece of modern A4 photocopy paper.

The black light test is useful but it must always be interpreted carefully as part of a holistic overview of the cap,

Chris