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Another General's Cap for opinions please

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    Another General's Cap for opinions please

    Good evening Gents,

    M-R's Thread on the General's Bergmutze caused me to take a closer look at this one that arrived yesterday. It also comes from a WAF member, and a rather distinguished one at that.

    There are some things I like about it, but you know how you get that gut feeling that something just isn't right - like this isn't talking to me in an old smokey German voice from 1945.

    The material is a heavy, almost winter-weight doe skin which seems OK and the lining is a superior grade of artificial silk - more like real silk actually. There is consistent faint soiling inside and out (which I know means nothing as that can be faked) and there is a nice clean area visible behind the sweatband and under the eagle's wings when slightly moved upwards.

    Regarding the eagle, if this is a total hump job then I would expect they would try to make it as textbook as possible with a nice silver or gold flatwire eagle, but maybe that's part of the story on this one, make it a non-standard "upgrade" or personal preference piece.

    Like the Bergmutze, the wire-mesh piping looks like it was applied by somebody who didn't make hats for a living, and the piping itself does not look to be fabricated like the silver piping you find on lower grade officer caps (wire-mesh affixed atop a linen or artificial silk band that usually serves as the area where the stitches go through).

    I've looked at a ton of pics of general's wearing overseas caps and the width of the soutache does not scare me and it is applied perfectly.

    So any opinions on this would be appreciated. I'd like to hope my insecurities about the quality and fidelity of fakes these days is just getting the better of me and all is OK.

    Thanks in advance.

    vr

    Bob

    #2
    a
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      #3
      Clean area behind scallop
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        #4
        c
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          #5
          d
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            #6
            e
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              #7
              You have developed an acute sense in many aspects of determining a good gut feeling...IT IS A NON STANDARD CAP..there has to be something in this cap that screams I am 72 years old..If you are unable to ascertain this..then I suppose I’d move on to the adage...,WHEN IN DOUBT DO WITHOUT..No doubt the perogative of a General in acquiring tailored items comes into play..Good Luck in your quest..It’s perceived truths or untruths on authenticity only come into play at SALE TIME...
              Billbert

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                #8
                Appreciate the comments Bill.

                I agree that General's could basically do what they wanted within reason and it certainly in-hand feels beautiful - it's again, just that feeling. Maybe it's because I am not used to seeing something like this that is not the textbook type of look in terms of how the material lays when accepting the piping etc..

                Anybody else? I see lots of very knowledgeable guys looking at it

                On a side note - if nothing on it just screams "puke - I'm a bad, well known repro" then I would be inclined to give it the benefit of the doubt and keep it and deal with the issue of believeability when I sell it down the road.

                One other thing of note is that erikn has a hat not of the same quality of material or construction with this same hurky soutache and same piping (just more oxidized) on the E-stand right now. It's been there for a month or two now with no bites. Probably not a good sign, or just a fluke that two appear for sale around the same time. http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=948748
                Last edited by Waffenreich; 03-20-2018, 10:11 PM.

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                  #9
                  I'm not to crazy about that very fine silky/fuzzy liner type material found on lots of fake bergmutze
                  Give a man an opinion and you feed him for a day,
                  teach a man to use the "search" function on the WAF and you feed him for a lifetime.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by Lenny W View Post
                    I'm not to crazy about that very fine silky/fuzzy liner type material found on lots of fake bergmutze
                    Good to see you at the show Lenny and thanks for your input.

                    It's kind of funny - that's one of the things I like about this. It's not really fuzzy - it's like glass when you run your fingers across it. I know you've got far more experience in soft caps than I so I'll chalk that one up to the questionable column.

                    Late news addition - it just dawned on me where else I've felt that silk-like lining - tailored officer's greatcoats and the single-button EM/NCO Waffen-SS M-43 cap I got from Mike (Virtual Grenadier) at the SOS. The exception is this is a mint green and the M-43 is a fawn/milky coffee color lining.

                    Regards!

                    Bob
                    Last edited by Waffenreich; 03-20-2018, 10:33 PM.

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                      #11
                      268 views and only 2 opinions?? Considering who I've seen view this Thread that's really disappointing.

                      Let's try to focus on the object - not who is asking for opinions, nor who it came from please.

                      Thank you kindly.

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                        #12
                        I have had many a m38 Officers sidecaps in grey and black but only a few without grommets (2 now) and I think the lack of grommets is what scares everybody a bit.

                        Because when the cap is constructed "correctly" like this one is the easiest way to identify fake from real is ussualy the grommets.

                        Having said that, I have never owned a generals sidecap before so I will be careful what I say here but the construction is correct.
                        And I like the application of the sweatband in front.
                        I have only seen silk lining like this in one other private purchase example without grommets for a Panzerjäger officer but I have no pictures of this anymore sadly.

                        Sorry I cannot help more

                        Mads

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                          #13
                          Hello,
                          I too am of the opinion that if you are not comfortable with it, you pass on it. There are aspects of this cap which would cause me to not want it in my collection. It very well may be alright, but it would not be for me.
                          Thank you,
                          Curtiss

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                            #14
                            Wouldn't be for me either...










                            Glenn
                            "A Man's Got to Know His Limitations"

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                              #15
                              Gents,

                              I appreciate you coming on and commenting, and for the most part I generally agree with your sentiments about grommets, etc..

                              Here are a few more pics of the cap that show the wear and overall patina. Also, I'm attaching a link to a Thread started by RonR on a cap of his that uses the same type of soutache (albeit about 1mm thinner), and wire mesh piping. http://wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/s...d.php?t=182042

                              My first reaction to this hat when I got it was "this is really nice" and when I went through it stitch-by-stitch my attention was grabbed by how detailed the manufacturing aspects were in terms of quality.

                              There was just something in my gut that I couldn't put my finger on. At this point I'm chalking it up to paranoia. After seeing Ron's cap I think this is just a tailor-made/private purchase specimen.

                              I'm still open to opinions though.

                              Thanks again.

                              Bob
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