I would much appreciate advice regarding this Visor Cap, if possible what unit or organisation it represents, also a "ball park" idea of value. The Cap is green, with a darker banding and a lighter piping colour. I know nothing at all about it, so will welcome comments. Regards, Clive.
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Back of Visor Cap -
Manufacture lable "Offizier Kleiderkasse Berlin ERIL Sonderclasse Extra"Comment
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Sweatband maker stamping ERELComment
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Final image - Side view of Visor CapComment
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Sorry Seebee1 but this is a repro cap. Hope you don't have much into it.Comment
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Here is a nice original Erel Exrta, have a look.
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=273651Comment
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Sorry ,it's a repro,not an original Erel
CarloComment
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Many thanks for your comments. I am interested to learn the obvious signs that this cap is a repro. I will be returning it for a refund and this will help me to explain why. Many thanks, Clive.Comment
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The most obvious sign is the plastic sweat diamond. It should be celluloid in period caps.
These repro-EREL caps are sold on EBay sometimes.
This one for example is the same postwar maker:
http://cgi.ebay.de/Wehrmacht-General...QQcmdZViewItem
Here I found one original to compare the lining. You will see the differences:
http://cgi.ebay.de/Schirmmuetze-Offi...QQcmdZViewItem
Search this forum for "erel" and you will find lots of examples for original caps.
Greetings,
EurocentricComment
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Many thanks Eurocentric, very helpful indeed. It is this sort of detail that I certainly would not have been aware of. Fortunately I seldom buy German material, but like many others I suspect, when something possibly unusual comes along, you have a try for it. The benefit of this forum is that we all can learn and be helped, even when we make errors in judgement! I have spoken to the seller and he assures me he will refund my payment.
Thanks again, Clive.
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Hi Clive, sorry to see you landed a repro cap, was it a dealer you bought it from? If so, name and shame, they shouldn't be allowed to try and get away with stuff like this.Comment
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I don't want to be overly charitable, but if this was from a dealer he may simply be ignorant. At least he's promised a refund. Let's hope he makes good on that promise!Originally posted by BenVK View Post
PaulComment
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If a dealer is going to deal with caps as famous as EREL's one should Know One's Onions so to speak. Too many dealers are being excused when selling these obvious fakes!Originally posted by Paul McKee View Post
I believe the excusing of dealers, needs to be saved for the more substantial elderly fakes that have fooled a lot of top collectors.
I have seen one of the 1960's fake erel's being taken to UK shows recently. It is really poor. Orange cotton lining and PRIVAT markings. NTZ and Minty know of this one it was posted a while ago. The dealer had removed it from the web site and has chosen to move it at shows instead, off piste so to speak. I would not be able to excuse this if it was sold and then brought up as a fake. The cap shows no known construction techniques.
back to the cap being discussed here. Too many of these erel repros are being passed off as genuine by tarting up the outside. This cap most probably started off as a re-enactment visor, I believe this to be the case as no attempt at skullduggery has been made to "enhance" the interior to rid itself of the plastic sweatshield and dirty the liner etc..
I would be interested to know who sold this as genuine and for how much?
seebee1, please let us know when you get your refund so we can all sleep easier at night.
regards JTComment
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Thanks for your thoughts, JT.
I probably AM being overly charitable. However while I agree with most of what you say, there is a difference between simple ignorance and more nefarious intentions. Antique dealers are particularly prone to ignorance in militaria. Sometimes this plays to collectors' advantage...oftentimes not. I've even seen dealers that specialize in awards or firearms that admit ignorance of uniforms and headgear.
The problem is, we don't know the circumstances of this transaction.
It may not even be a dealer that sold this to him. I guess I'm not ready to start frothing at the mouth and demand a public humiliation for this individual with the circumstances yet unknown. Yet if it turns out to be a dealer that certainly knows better...and especially if he tries to again move this fake using other means, I'll be right there beside you with pitchfork and burning torch in hand!
PaulComment
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