I am posting these 2 visors for review and comment. The first is an officer's visor with Schupo piping, but a WH band which is integral to the cap. There are no signs of holes for either a WH eagle or wreath. The insignia appears original to the cap:
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NEC SOLI CEDIT -
Side:NEC SOLI CEDIT -
Close-up of band--it is not re-banded--this could be a WH Admin with Police insignia--maybe this is the "real" GFP visor!NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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Interior--it is an "LLD" cap:NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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Here is the 2nd--this is a Schupo with the mottled-green body:NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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The band is WH-colored and slipped over the original band. Why the insignia is covered, I don't know.NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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The cover is cut quite closely to fit nicely over the band:NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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"Marke Odd" (Otto Dittmann of Dresden) is the maker--note this one lacks the cross-stitching to the lining (which seems to appear only on their Extramutzen):NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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The 2 together for comparison. Any thoughts/opinions?NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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Hello,
As a police collector I can say that I have no explaination for your caps. The first looks like an army administrative officer with police insignia but the material is police green. Very strange.
The second is clearly a police cap, but the use of a green band does not fit any police branch or use that I can imagine. If the piping had been orange I would have said Mot. Gend. transferred to the FeldGendarmerie, but green piping..........NO idea what so ever.
Regards,
Bill UnlandComment
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Interesting caps, both.
The officers cap I feel could have had the insignia added postwar. But you say there are no signs of previous insignia....strange. I have never believed in Polizei caps with dark green band. It should be brown.
The NCO visor I find most interesting. Allthough it is impossible to determine when the green band was added and put over the insignia I feel it might be the following:
Just after wars end many police officials remained on duty throughout Germany. Sometimes they just tore of offisive insignia (ie Eagles) but often they were simply covered. For example pictures exist where a simple brassard is worn on the upper left arm to cover the sleeve-eagle. I feel that your cap might have had the same done.....Insignia cover shortly after may 1945 to hide offensive symbols and than simply used on duty.Comment
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Hi,
First one looks like an early West German police cap, to me.
-GComment
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Stonemint,
Two very interesting police visor caps. I have an example of the first one that you show manufactured by the same maker, LLD. The only difference is that my cap is an NCO with orange cloth lining and a leather chin strap. Interestingly, my cap too has a brown band that is applied over the green band in the same manner as your NCO police cap. My cap is boldly property stamped to the Hessische Polizei in the lining. It also has a round NS eagle style stamp that is not readable.
I think there are two possibilities. Obviously these are all original transitional police caps. My cap has wear and tear and the construction appears to be from the 1930s-40s. It is slightly different from yours because it is NCO grade and not Officer quality (i.e. the sweatband is sewn directly to the band and visor and lower quality lining). I have seen the different colored bands on peaked caps before, so it seems to be an example of period German thriftyness and I have no problem with this being an official change during a transitional period. The caps are either from the immediate postwar period or from the uniform change just prior to 1936, IMHO.
They could very well be an immedaite postwar transition before the Allies settled on mostly blue uniforms for the German police. Either old stock that was modified (i.e. your brown band cap with a removable green cover) or newly manufactured with old stock parts for the Polizei. In this case the eagles would have been added postwar to sell the caps.
They could also be transitional Landespolizei caps from circa 1935 before the brown collars and cap bands were adopted. There are plenty of photos of this type of cap being worn by LAPO along with dark green tunic collars prior to the 1936 change. Gerd just posted a Landespolizei tunic of this type on the Police Forum under Prussian Police Headgear. These caps might have then been modified when caps with brown bands became regulation (i.e. my green band cap with the removable brown cover).
Thanks for bringing these caps up.Comment
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Bringing these to the top for the Polizei guys.NEC SOLI CEDITComment
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