Panzer IV H Fenders

[Garry Redmon]

I am looking for leads in finding original Panzer IV H fenders that will be used in a restoration. Here is a photo of the tread pattern on the fender. http://armorfortheages.com/PanzerIVfender.jpg Any help in locating original fenders would be appreciated. I'm sure the owners will pay a reasonable price for them if they even exist.

The chassis number of the panzer IV is 85575. I would like to find out if anyone here has references and can determine the manufacturer of this particular Panzer IV and, if it can be determined, which sub-contractor supplied the fender stock and if there is anyway to find out which unit(s) this vehicle was issued to during the war.

Thanks,
Garry

[RTY]

Hello, Garry.

Will Phelps wrote in his book that this is Nubelungenwerke.
This can be easily checked if you find 3-letter manufacturer codes on the tank details (I can describe where to search, but this will require paint removing).

[Garry Redmon]

Thanks. I've seen his Panzer IV Universe site, but didn't know about his book. Do you have a title? I am quite far from the Panzer IV so I don't have immediate access to it. I can let the owner know where to look for the code if you tell me where he can look.

Thanks,
Garry

[RTY]

This is the book: http://www.perthmilitarymodelling.co...ks/pz4surv.htm
I've sent you e-mail, please read it.

[hdoy]

Pz.Kpfw.IV Ausf.H

Hi Garry,
I can confirm RTYs identification of Nibelungenwerke as the assembly plant for this Panzer. It was from the first batch of Pz.Kpfw.IV Ausf.H assembled by this firm in Austria. Fgst.Nr.85575 would have been completed about mid August 1943.

Hilary

[Garry Redmon]

Thank you all for the information on the manufacturer and date. Now the next step is to find the proper fenders. Anyone care to theorize who provided tread plate stock to Nibelungenwerk or know of a battlefield artifact collector that would have some?

Garry

[RTY]

I think this will be very difficult to find. Probably you can find some pieces of another modifications and/or vendors. Then you will need to rework them to correspond the tank.

I think the best way is to produce new fenders and search for the original details for them (mountings).
The single problem is to get the sheet of the required pattern. Maybe this is not a problem in USA? In Russia this is very expensive.

[me6_130]

I have sometimes seen a similar pattern when workers rapair the path in the street, but slightly smaller. I don't know if it might help.

Carles

[Fe 26]

This seems like a common problem. If you notice in pictures of the Panzer IV at Munster, the flooring is made from the wrong generic modern workshop plate. The kind that we make Pick Up tool boxes out of in the US.

If it was me, I would try to buy or borrow any section of the right pattern that I could find. Then ask a manufacture or custom machine shop to make a sheet that copies it. Maybe even go as far as contracting it out to China or India.

That route could get expensive as the manufacture might require a minimum order.

If that ends up being the case, I would contact museums and make a website where people can pre-buy a section to use for their own tanks. This has been done with US Half track armored bolts at G503.com.


I would think many would be interested. Almost all of the Syrian Panzer IV's have the wrong fenders. And many german tanks in museums have no floors.

[Panzerknacker12]

There are two other patterns as well. The cris crossing diagonal lines type, and the type like in my Skdfz 250 and other tanks such as Panther which is the little "pyramid" looking floor plate.

[Garry Redmon]

Thanks everyone for the responses. This particular Panzer IV is Czech/Syrian/Israel. It needs fenders on both sides from about the driver/RO hatches forward. The owner was quoted a price for having new ones made that was cost prohibitive. The photo in Carles post of the Russian pattern is very close. The tread pattern seems to be more distinct than those on this Panzer IV. The tread pattern looks like the type used on earlier Panzer IVs. Measurements from the tread pattern on this Panzer IV are: each raised tread is about 2 cm long and 2.2 mm wide. There is about 1.7 cm space between each raised tread.

The owner may eventually have to settle for reproduction fenders, but he very much wants to use original materials. Carles, is there anyway you could measure one of these tread plates to see how close it comes to the measurements above? If they do match and the owner of the panzer IV wants to purchase some, the next step would be to find out what company manufactures this plate and then find out where to buy it.

Thanks again for all the help.
Garry

[me6_130]

The photo in Carles post of the Russian pattern is very close.

Carles, is there anyway you could measure one of these tread plates to see how close it comes to the measurements above?

Thanks again for all the help.
Garry

Hello Garry,

I live by Barcelona (EU), not in Russia Anyhow, when I saw your thread, I had a look around the internet and foud that pic, from a company in Argentina. I'll try to go further and get the measures from several companies, to see if any matches. What should the thickness of the plate be? About how much would you need?

Are you part of the restoring team?


Carles

[me6_130]

There are two other patterns as well. The cris crossing diagonal lines type, and the type like in my Skdfz 250 and other tanks such as Panther which is the little "pyramid" looking floor plate.

I have also found these: Are they similar to original?


Carles

[me6_130]

Or this other one, perhaps?


Carles

[46IR]

might be an idea to contact this member he seems to find a lot of panzer bits good luck
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=388008