What is a steiner??

[Matt Starr]

x

[reidmuller]

A lot of people belive this story is made up as the guy (i assume it was guy sajer who wrote it) was never in the GD as no vets can remembrt him
i read it about 3 years ago so ill be buggerd if i remember what was in it but i remeber it was quite a good read
sorry i dont know what a stiner is
Adam

[Matt Starr]

Its not the most eloquently written book so far, and I'm not impressed by the lack of detail. Hopefully the book will progress in to a good old read though. Thanks Adam
Matt

[Theodor]

Never heard of a "Steiner"... Maybe a mis-spelled Steyr?

[Matt Starr]

x

[Cam_S]

The forgotten Soldier

Hello,

I will have to agree with the fact that there is alot of unusual terminology in the book. It seems like he refers to everything in nick names and slang. For instance he refers to the MG 34/42 as a Spandu. Its been about three years since I have read the book so I can not really remember what context he was talking about when he refered to the steiner. I don't think that it was the proper name but more of a name given to it by the troops. ie. calling the Pak 41/43 the Barn Door because it was so hard to handle.

I have never heard that he was not in GD PD but after reading the book I never thought to inqiure. I would like to hear more about this. I remember a While back there was a thread about Sven Hassel, which exposed him. So none of the vets actually remember sajer? what about Hauptman Wieserda??? (Can't spell his name) the captain who Sajer looks up to? I don't remember him ever refering to a numbered unit so I really don't know what to think.

Anyways these were just my 2 cents.

Cam

[J.von Canon]

I would'nt get to concerned with a "steiner",or whatever the (unknown)novelist calls it.

Some time back there was a long thread about this fraudaulent so-called "Guy Sajer"
It's a novel;long represented as a soldiers account...

[Lloyd I.]

Whatever Sajer's case is, his book was a tremendously good read which I devoured during my detail at Fort Derussy while Aphex Twin Ambient Works conjured up images of the Soviet steppes.

I believe he was referring to the Steyr which I am providing a picture of.

There was a Sajer on GD rolls. He was French volunteer and in the book he even mentions his difficulty with the German language. This could account for his naming conventions. His friend Hans and Capt. Wiesredau are both lost to time as is the girl he fell in love with. He couldnt bear to find out if she had been killed in an air raid preferring instead to remember the young girl alive and in love.

It is a powerful story.

[rkdek]

Talking Steyr?

This is mine:

[CWP]

Here is the deal on The Forgotten Soldier. Guy Sajer was a pseudonym, so were the names he assigned to people in the text. This is understandable since many of the people he names were killed, often horribly, and the author may have wanted to spare the relatives of the deceased these painful details. Also the author wanted to conceal his identity since he lived in 1970's France when the book was published in a climate not exactly supportive of French Wehrmacht volunteers. Searching for names like Sajer or Wesreidau on GD lists is fruitless since these are pseudonyms, and even if they were real, the records are incomplete due to many of them being lost or destroyed during the war. The book was written in French, describing events that took place in German, then it was translated into English. It is likely that much was lost in translation. Some people make a big deal about certain mistakes the author makes with small details. I think many of these mistakes can be explained by translation errors, things like the different meanings of the word "battalion" in German, French and English. As far as using terms like "Spandau" or "Steiner", it is true that different German units in different areas had different slang terms for equipment items. An example of this is "Black Edelweiss" by Johann Voss, he relates that in Karelia mortars were called "mungoes" but he only heard this term in that area. Several people that I know through reenacting attend the annual GD Treffen in Munster and have a great relationship with the surviving veterans. The consensus among the veterans of GD is that The Forgotten Soldier is a real account, and that despite whatever mistakes the author makes (he places the cuff title on the wrong sleeve for one), it is a book that could only have been written by someone who was there.

Chris P.

[Jeff V]

This is an outstanding book!,and should be read by everyone with an interest in ww2 history. I could never understand why there has been so much effort to try and prove that Sajer does not exist. I remember years ago when the Karabiner Collectors Network had a great interview with a german sniper. This man had wonderful insights on his service in the war, but could not remember much at all about the details of his rifle. The fact is these people were fighting for their very lives every day, NOT trying to remember the stupid details that we as collectors want to know.

jeff

[J.von Canon]

"Guy Sajer"-whatever...

This NOVEL was treated in an earlier thread ad nauseum.
If you think it is a "real' account-fine...
Researchers pulled it from reading lists(where it HAD been)of the U.S.Army War College as the author/book has no bonafides recognizable.
In fact I have heard GD veterans- spokesmen considered the book bogus,not the other way round.
The ghost-author "Guy Sajer"(who some,including myself)think is the same "Sven Hassel"of earlier pulp blood-curdling war stories,writes in the very SAME way,to include very English references as "Spandaus","bloody"this and "bloody" that;it goes on and on.
I'm sure "Guy Sajer" would get a kick out of reading this thread!

[Mr.Jerry D]

My uncle fought in Europe WWII with a TD support unit. He still calls Stukas Messerschmits, every german cannon is an "88". MP-40s are "burp guns" and every tank is a "tiger".

I have never corrected a veteran on thier account of history and I never will. They were there, we (the lucky ones) have the luxury to just read about it safe & warm.

IF Guy didn't exist (I believe he did), whoever wrote the book gave me a new respect for soldiers on every side of war.

[J.von Canon]

One more time..."Guy Sajer"

Jerry;exposure of a fictional account posing as an actual combat narrative is NO criticism of genuine veterans accounts...
But if you read the (bogus) "Sven Hassel" accounts (i.e."Wheels of Terror",etc.)you will see great similarities to them and the "Guy Sajer"novel,which some of us think to be written by the same author.
Veterans who incorrectly call an MG42 a "Spandau" is a simple comment concerning the routine tendency of the British soldier to apply this term to German m.g.'s in the Second World War.It also tends to indicate the 'ghost author' is likely English;further reinforced by his continual use of the word "bloody" this 'n that...
If the Guy Sajer account makes you appreciate combat soldiers-that is a good thing.
But don't think it "history."

[CWP]

I don't recall seeing "bloody" in the Forgotten Soldier. Also- it is a well known FACT that the book was published first in Fench, in France ("Soldat oublie") and then translated into English. That's right, the English version is definitely a TRANSLATION so any words like "bloody" (which I don't recall anyway) would have been put there by the translator, not "Sajer." I think going to all the trouble to write the book in a foreign language then have it translated by someone else would be too much for "Sven Hassel" or any other fraud for that matter, it wouldn't make sense.

Chris P.