L /14 GWB stupid question

[juoneen]

I have a stupis question about a GWB L/14.
Has anyone ever seen a fire guilded L/14 GWB with the pin that comes to a point (as a v) as opposed to the standard straight across end of the pin restrike (floch),or the rounded tip types, and does anyone know if fire guilding has ever been seen on any L/14 known floch repros.
I have been told they outlawed fire guilding after the war, and most all badges that are repros are painted type finishes, and not fire guilded.
Can anyone set me straight on fire guilding, and if and when the nazis used that finish. I would assume it would be found on earlier badges as it supposedly was a dangerous process, as mercuric compounds were used to achieve the guilding . Does anyone have an original fireguilded L/14 they can show. Thanks

[Mike Kenny]

Hi,

I would suggest doing a search for L/14s (top right of the screen). You'll find examples of genuine early fire-gilded tombak examples.

Regards
Mike

[juoneen]

Thank - you . I checked the L/14 threads, and yes there were some nice gilded Gwb's, but i didnt see an actual original gilded L/14, and I dont think ive seen an original L/14 anywhere on the site with an original gilded finish with the / mark included , (i may have missed it) . I saw the L14 original , (no /)so if i missed the gilded one somewhere , maybe someone could mention the page that it is on. I appreciate any of your assistance.
Also ,does anyone out there have an Original example, as i believe there WERE originals gilded by that company. I also know its a down trodden badge as a result of your heated discussions relating to the floch connection, as his choice to restrike.
I wouldnt suspect floch ever fire gilded any repros . All i could find ,so far ive seen ,have the fired paint post 42 finishes as outlined on your finishes in the medals manufacturing section ,of whermacht awards, research tools / construction methods.
Sorry to be redundant,not trying to beat a dead horse,although it would be nice to see an original example of this much faked badge, or wouldnt anybody want to have one, even if original because of the bad reputation re: floch.
It Reminds me of L/58 in the sixtys. many people passed on good badges as a result of the stigma associated, as nowdays people actually,avidly search them out, as at that time you couldnt give them away .
One person on one thread I believe I recall ,said you had to be an expert to know an original gilded L/14, but stated that they DO exist ??.
Wouldnt the gilding, examined by a powerful eye loop show the grainy irridescent ,finish un reproduceable by any other method ,as described on the construction finished section, be the hook to telling good from bogus.(if anyone hasnt read that excellent research paragraph on finishes, it might be worth checkin into, as i found it very facinating)
I found the finish sections' lessons on gilding finishes description may hold the key to cutting an original one out of the heard of bogus examples. I also would figure originals in the gilded versions early, and would be not as often encountered , but i may be incorrect.
Are there Any who venture any opinions out there, in the shadows by the quiet non boat rockers who would chance sharing an opinion from experience?. thanks again juoneen

[Hans N]

Hi,

Are you talking about a zink or a Buntmetal badge?

[Alex K.]

I don´t know if it´s fire gilded, but it received a golden finish and is a Tombak piece ans marked with L/14. Somebody painted it Black, so don´t worry about the Black paint on the badge, it was originally a golden one.

[Alex K.]

back

[Mike Kenny]

.....I checked the L/14 threads, and yes there were some nice gilded Gwb's, but i didnt see an actual original gilded L/14, and I dont think ive seen an original L/14 anywhere on the site with an original gilded finish with the / mark included , (i may have missed it)...

Here's a link to my example which you must have missed - original, tombak, fire-gilded but worn.....

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...F14+gold+wound

Regards
Mike

[juoneen]

So let me see if i have this right.Please bare with me,
Is it true or false that:ALL "raised" mark L/14 GWb's with the mark in the middle of the badge even with original gilding are not ever a ww2 original? And did they ever make a warime L/14 marked that way in that spot with that early finsh?
Also: would you venture to say , its 100% true with no exceptions that the only original gilded L/14 's made by that company are only stamp marked into the badge as your's is under the pin catch to be correct and period awards?
It happens I did see that badge , but that wasnt the L/14 badge raised mark i was curious about ,maybe im not clear on my question as originnally asked .
I was curious if they ever made a period original example with the wide pin , thats fashioned like a v to a point, and bears the raised L/14 in the general, or same position of the marks found on the floch fakes.
In conclusion : When floch faked this makers badges , did they fashion their repros from an actual original WW2 period example that had the raised mark in the middle, or was their fake a total fantasy piece, because they never made an original badge during the war with the raised mark in that spot ,and never had a wide pin, like the flochs post war examples??So would you say ,all the badges with the raised L/14 similar to the repro floch examples have never been seen with a period original fire gilded finish, so that means they never made any marked that raised way during the early years of the original wound badges. Thanks again My apologies , and I hope this isnt too confusing.

[Mike Kenny]

So let me see if i have this right.Please bare with me,
Is it true or false that:ALL "raised" mark L/14 GWb's with the mark in the middle of the badge even with original gilding are not ever a ww2 original? THERE ARE NO GENUINE TOMBAK (early) GOLD OR SILVER GRADE RAISED MARK L/14 WOUND BADGES. And did they ever make a warime L/14 marked that way in that spot with that early finsh? FLOCH NEVER MADE WARTIME BADGES. EARLY TOMBAK L/14 BADGES WITH FIRE-GILT FINISH DID NOT HAVE RAISED MAKER MARKS. SOME APPARENTLY GENUINE ZINC L/14 EXAMPLES ARE KNOWN WITH A RAISED MAKER MARK IN THE CENTER OF THE BADGE.
Also: would you venture to say , its 100% true with no exceptions that the only original gilded L/14 's made by that company are only stamp marked into the badge as your's is under the pin catch to be correct and period awards? NOT POSSIBLE TO SAY "WITH NO EXCEPTIONS", HOWEVER THERE ARE CURRENTLY NO KNOWN GENUINE EARLY TOMBAK EXCEPTIONS.
It happens I did see that badge , but that wasnt the L/14 badge raised mark i was curious about ,maybe im not clear on my question as originnally asked .
I was curious if they ever made a period original example with the wide pin , thats fashioned like a v to a point, and bears the raised L/14 in the general, or same position of the marks found on the floch fakes. NO KNOWN GENUINE TOMBAK OR ZINC L/14 EXAMPLES IN ANY GRADE ARE KNOWN WITH A WIDE PIN.
In conclusion : When floch faked this makers badges , did they fashion their repros from an actual original WW2 period example that had the raised mark in the middle, or was their fake a total fantasy piece, because they never made an original badge during the war with the raised mark in that spot ,and never had a wide pin, like the flochs post war examples??So would you say ,all the badges with the raised L/14 similar to the repro floch examples have never been seen with a period original fire gilded finish, so that means they never made any marked that raised way during the early years of the original wound badges. ALL WIDE-PINNED L/14 AND L/63 FLOCH EXAMPELS ARE REPRODUCTIONS. THE FLOCHS ARE NOT FIRE-GILDED AS PER GENUINE EARLY WARTIME EXAMPLES. FLOCH NEVER MADE WARTIME EXAMPLES - PERIOD.

Thanks again My apologies , and I hope this isnt too confusing.

I DO NOT KNOW HOW TO BE CLEARER THAN THE ABOVE REPLIES!

[juoneen]

I have a question about your gold you have posted in this thread. Why would it be painted black? Could it have been taken from inventories when shortages of black wound badges were needed, and etched to remove some or most of the gilding so the paint would stick. I can still see some gilding remaining thats around the 10 to 11:00 area of the wreath. Mercury would remove the finish for painting also.
Wouldnt that make it a rare, and unusual badge to have been changed from gold to black, and thusly make it much more valueable as a original variation. Whomever tried to remove the paint was kinda foolish wouldnt you say, as it looks to me like it was issued as a true black as its even into the makers mark. Truly one for the book if one hasnt been in the book as of to date.