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**all1knew** · 11-05-2016, 06:38 PM

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**all1knew** · 11-05-2016, 06:38 PM

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**all1knew** · 11-05-2016, 06:42 PM

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**all1knew** · 11-05-2016, 06:46 PM

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**all1knew** · 11-05-2016, 06:53 PM

a good reference thread on these that I just came across:

http://wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/s...d.php?t=590470

William Kramer

**der-hase-fee** · 11-06-2016, 03:26 PM

Not original, unfortunately.

**Br. James** · 11-06-2016, 04:46 PM

I agree with Andreas' assessment, sad to say. The General Gau Honor Badge is one of my favorite awards and this example does not have the beautiful detail in the silver wreath that genuine examples present.

In his initial comment, William presents a number of questions:

"what was the difference between the 1923 and 1925 award dates, what do they signify and why are there both enamel and painted version from the same maker, does anyone know?"

As I understand it, there is still no clear explanation of why two versions of this badge existed, bearing different years. Both versions appear to have the approbation of the NSDAP as they are both referred to in the Organisationsbuch, but without justification. And while it seems understandable that several Gaue decided to get together and utilize the same design for a commemorative badge, even that brings up other questions, such as why the Gaue that participated in this design changed over the years of the TR; why other Gaue that never created a commemorative badge decided not to participate in this "General Gau Honor Badge" design; whether the Gaue that did participate in this design utilized both the 1923 and the 1925 designs or did each Gau use only one of the two; what did the two different dates signify to each of the Gaue that presented this badge; and what did this badge signify in it's very presentation -- was it given to honor very early Alterkämpfers living in that Gau, as some other Gau Honor Badges did, or to commemorate the foundation of the Gau itself, or...??

I believe there are genuine examples of the General Gau Honor Badge bearing both 1923 and 1925 with the enamel swastika, and it appears likely that both versions existed from the time of institution in 1933. It seems that the painted version may have been a later effort to cut costs in manufacturing this badge, just as the simplification of the pin system seems to have evolved for the same reason.

Just some thoughts...without answers, I'm afraid!

Br. James

**der-hase-fee** · 11-06-2016, 05:18 PM

These badges can be quite controversial. Whether or not one embraces everything discussed in the linked thread, I personally have come to the conclusion that the analysis of the font is quite helpful. The discussed badge's font is per the lower example in this picture (but for the "3", of course).

As far as the wreath is concerned, more variations - more and less detailed - can be observed.

**der-hase-fee** · 11-06-2016, 07:16 PM

And check this thread out, please.

I did like that badge, but with the markings around the rivets being also found on this one, I am having second thoughts.

**Gary Symonds** · 11-06-2016, 08:12 PM

In my opinion Kramer's 1923 Gau is an original.

I recently purchased a 1923 enamel and posted pictures on the WAF. Kramer's and mine are identical. http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...ght=gau+badges

As to the reason for the two dates 1923/1925, my opinion is the 1923's were for members who joined between 1920 and 1923. After the failed November 1923 beer hall event, Hitler goes to prison, the Party is outlawed. He gets out of prison in December 1924, and reforms the Party in February 1925.

The cut for granting the common gau in 1933 was when you joined. A member from 1920-23, would get the 1923 badge. If you joined in 1925-33, you received the 1925.

Why enamel or paint, still unknown.

**Erich B.** · 11-06-2016, 08:54 PM

From the photos posted, the 2 enameled badges do not appear to be identical. Gary's has the typical pattern of raised shapes on the reverse of the wreath whereas the first one posted lacks these. There are differences in the swastika reverse as well.
Erich

**Gary Symonds** · 11-06-2016, 09:18 PM

Originally posted by Erich B. View Post

From the photos posted, the 2 enameled badges do not appear to be identical. Gary's has the typical pattern of raised shapes on the reverse of the wreath whereas the first one posted lacks these. There are differences in the swastika reverse as well.
Erich

Eric I am holding in my hand my 1923 enamel, and I can say with full confidence that Kramer's wreath and swastika are identical.

If your computer skills are up to it, and mine are not, maybe you can mark the disputed areas in Kramer's 1923 so I can see where you are coming from.

**Br. James** · 11-07-2016, 09:11 AM

Thanks for your considered thoughts on some of the questions I raised below; any thoughts on the other questions?

Thanks again,

Br. James

**all1knew** · 11-07-2016, 02:34 PM

thank you guys, the seller says I may return it if I so desire.

I appreciate your expert evaluation but now what to do?

I actually just bought the 1925 enamel off the e-stand so I thought I was going to have the pair. Does the 1925 at least check out? Might as well have this one vetted as well while I've got you all.

William Kramer

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1923 enamel Gau Honor badge

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