1929 Nurnberg Tinnie - is it real?

[John W. Krueger]

I would sincerely appreciate any opinions as to the authenticity of this badge. It has an RZM marking on the reverse side. Thanks.

[Thomas Bendixen]

Hi John

Looks good to me

Cheers Thomas

[Military]

I agree with Tom. A later version but a nice piece.

Mil

[Br. James]

Hi Tom,

I also agree: a good one, dating from the early 1930s and made by the well-known producer of this badge: Ferdinand Hoffstätter of Bonn.

Cheers,

Br. James

[ErichS]

Agree with all that it's good. These later pieces are at times harder to find than the early ones.

[Military]

The prices of these 1929 have shot up in the last 2-3 years.

Mil

[Gregorio Torres]

Hi Tom,

I also agree: a good one, dating from the early 1930s and made by the well-known producer of this badge: Ferdinand Hoffstätter of Bonn

No too early, cause it's RZM marked

[Jean-Claude]

No too early, cause it's RZM marked

As far as I know "RZM 15" (later RZM M1/15) is Ferdinand Hoffstätter of Bonn so BR James is correct for the maker

JC

[Gregorio Torres]

Is right about the maker, but this badge isn't made in early 30's

[ErichS]

Is right about the maker, but this badge isn't made in early 30's

It was most likely made after 1936 when the badge became an official award of the party.

[Br. James]

In my opinion, as I mentioned previously, this badge dates from the early 1930s, not as late as 1936. My understanding of the RZM system of markings is:

* The Zeugmeisterei der NSDAP was formed on 1 April 1929 solely to provide good quality, approved, and reasonably priced equipment for the SA, SS, and other party organizations.
* organization's name was later changed to the more familiar ‘Reichszeugmeisterei der NSDAP,” or RZM, and it was instituted in 1934 as the quality control and licensing agency of the Party, involved in literally everything produced for the use of any political organization in Nazi Germany, down to the buttons on a shirt.
* The full system of RZM classification and licensing did not come on line until March of 1935; prior to that, items were marked with the RZM logo only or continued to bear the manufacturer's logo and/or name, or sometimes carried the RZM logo and the manufacturer's license number without the classification (ie: M1/) -- such as this piece bears.
* Political badges in metal made after March of 1935 included the full maker's license code as follows: RZM logo, followed by M1 and the manufacturer's license number -- which for the Hoffstätter firm was RZM M1/15.

Cheers,

Br. James

[Jean-Claude]

In my opinion, as I mentioned previously, this badge dates from the early 1930s, not as late as 1936. My understanding of the RZM system of markings is:

* The Zeugmeisterei der NSDAP was formed on 1 April 1929 solely to provide good quality, approved, and reasonably priced equipment for the SA, SS, and other party organizations.
* organization's name was later changed to the more familiar ‘Reichszeugmeisterei der NSDAP,” or RZM, and it was instituted in 1934 as the quality control and licensing agency of the Party, involved in literally everything produced for the use of any political organization in Nazi Germany, down to the buttons on a shirt.
* The full system of RZM classification and licensing did not come on line until March of 1935; prior to that, items were marked with the RZM logo only or continued to bear the manufacturer's logo and/or name, or sometimes carried the RZM logo and the manufacturer's license number without the classification (ie: M1/) -- such as this piece bears.
* Political badges in metal made after March of 1935 included the full maker's license code as follows: RZM logo, followed by M1 and the manufacturer's license number -- which for the Hoffstätter firm was RZM M1/15.

Cheers,

Br. James

Makes sens to me BR James, attached is a pict of an M34 NSDAP eagle with the same RZM # configuration (RZM 72) as the RPT 29 discussed here. This bird
only had a lifespan of 2 years (1934/36) before it was replaced by another version (M36) which bears the M1 RZM prefix

Best regards

JC

[Gregorio Torres]

Maybe, but... Why a firm would wish to remake what was a common festabzeichen? What evidence do exist that this item was made in early 30's and why not after the institition of the award?

[Jean-Claude]

Maybe, but... Why a firm would wish to remake what was a common festabzeichen? What evidence do exist that this item was made in early 30's and why not after the institition of the award?

Not an expert on these so I dont know for sure but hopefully someone that does know will kick in...IMO, like the 1931 SA Streffen badge, the 1929 RTP was originally intended only as a rally/event badge with what that normally implies: cheap, mass produced to minimize costs (& maximize fund raising) and only intended to be worn for the event and then put away as a souvenir or discarded

Later, when it was granted official Party Decoration status and people started wearing them permanently a lot of the initial production was either out of circulation, lost, or fell apart through wear and not enough original event badges were available to meet ongoing demand. These either had to be restruck from original dies or remade altogether in fancier versions as decorations which would have had to follow the regulations (eg RZM) applicable at the time

So, from my limited perspective I would say that the 29 RTP shown here is probably a restrike of the original event badge produced by the major supplier of the original rally badge in compliance with the regulations of the time which happen to reflect the earliest RZM # format which was only used for a rather short period before the definitive RZM numbering structure was adopted.

I havent paid much attention to this particular item because I dont have one yet but if it follows the same pattern as the 1931 SA streffen it probably also exists in later versions with the M1 prefix RZM #and in a variety of configurations: solid back, better metal, different hardware etc.

Regards

JC

[Br. James]

I agree, JC. At the time it was developed, the 1929 RPT was intended to be the annual NSDAP Congress, plus associated organizational events...and nothing more than that. It was assumed by the Party planners that there would be a 1930 Congress, a 1931 Congress and a 1932 Congress, each within a framework of major public events, though that was not the current history of these annual Party gatherings even at that time: the previous one took place in Nuremberg in 1927, and the 1928 NSDAP Congress did not take the form of a full-blown major event due to the financial constraints the Party was under in order to support the numerous election campaigns throughout Germany. The national Presidential and Reichstag campaigns of 1930-32 were a whirlwind of activity...and of great financial expense to the Party...and while the annual corporate meetings took place, they were much-subdued local gatherings without the great hoopla of major public events. Then Hitler became Reichschancellor and everything changed for the NSDAP; no more funding worries or time constraints! So while the 1929 RPT came to be considered the final major event for the Party during the Kämpfzeit, the 1933 RPT would become the first such Congress and event of the New Age of National Socialism, the thousand-year Reich.

The 1929 RPT Badge did not become officially recognized by the NSDAP as an Honor Badge until November 6, 1936. By that time the popular sentiment within the Party had grown to revere and to mythologize the RPT of 1929 and much else that took place during the Time of Struggle, just as the Cult of the Martyrs of the Movement was being developed and the new Temples of Honor memorializing the Heroes of the Putsch was being constructed in Munich. The Coburg Badge and the Blood Order were already culturally established, as was the GPB which greatly honored all those Party Comrades who had joined the Movement in it's infancy (in 1925) and remained loyal and committed to it throughout those hard years of the Kämpfzeit.

It was a time of transition and the RPT of 1929 came to represent the Party as it prepared for the final push toward the Revolutionary victory of National Socialism.

Br. James