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My opinion the two enamel party badges are good. I don't know about the adelwiess pin.
Cheers
BrianComment
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M1/34 party badge is good, the Heim ins Reich is a common Fake and the other is anyone's guess.Comment
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Party pin is good and if Jos F. says the Heim ins Reich is fake, it is high likely indeed a fake.
Regards, WimFreedom is not for FreeComment
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The pin plate on the Heim badge, looks to be correct on it. Looking closer at the swastika as well, the red has the little bubbles in it like original DVG Westmark badges. The only thing I could think of to make the badge questionable would be the makers mark.
Cheers
BrianComment
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Hi Brian,
You're right in the fact that this badge looks very good. The FR mm is copied by fakers (the coffin pin plate type for example). I suppose original FR mm pieces always had a round pin plate? Maybe Fuess can tell us a bit more???
Regards, WimFreedom is not for FreeComment
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Wim
The pinplate is rounded on the badge. I know what you mean by the coffin pin plate and those usually have sharp cuts at each end and is thinner then what is seen here.
Cheers
BrianComment
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Hi WimOriginally posted by Wim Vangossum View PostHi Brian,
You're right in the fact that this badge looks very good. The FR mm is copied by fakers (the coffin pin plate type for example). I suppose original FR mm pieces always had a round pin plate? Maybe Fuess can tell us a bit more???
Nobody knows who FR was, but i guess it is possible that it could be an old scarce abbreviation that has been copied. Most likely a Made up logo though.
The Small plates, similar to those used by Hoffstätter are on plenty of Post war fakes, mostly good fakes though. BUT, when the plate is soldered on off-center, it should be a dead give away, as it is with all the other fakes made by the same faker.
See pic of Good, but fake hitlerbewegung badges, same plates off center
See pic of Fake Wagner, Aurich and Hoffstätter badges, same plates off center.
Some period badges do have the plates soldered off center, but not like this. Besides, the material is wrong, it should be screaming out to you.
I wrote so much about Period dies and slogans before, so i wont repeat that, but the Front is also the dead give away that the die is cut on modern machinery and not period hand cut.
See pic of two genuine, hand cut fronts of the Heim ins Reich badge.
Notice the letters, just like they should be. next to a Fake Adolf Hitler slogan, that you can clearly see has been milled with a modern machine. The fake Heim ins Reich badges are the same, all too perfect lettering, made only a few decades ago. That is the give away on badges like the Fake Hungarian (with all sorts of makers marks, usually the same though as found on the Heim ins Reich badges
) and the fake DVG and 1938 Protektorat etc etc.. all modern jokes.
But we just saw this exact same thing mentioned on the Swedish badge post, with a good example of what period lettering should look like.
That does not mean that some badges were not perfect, some were, just not as perfect as these are though, an Original badge will have that Original feel to it, and when you enlarge the pictures up to 2000 x 2000 you should still feel comfortable with the badge.
The "Coffin" pin plate is only a more recent way of saying straight away that a badge is duff, those pin plates are not that old, and still used today. Early fakes have period pins, like the hoffstätter semi-round ones, or the typical long Josef Preissler catches for example are found on fake Aurich badges..etc etc, and round ones, and even Ges gesch marked ones. After the war, there must have still be stockpiles of pin attachments, plenty to last for ages, so it would depend who was making the fakes.. if it was in China, then sure they would have used something else, but a maker in Germany or Austria would have been using the same catches that they already had in stock, or in some rare cases, were able to actually make themselves.Comment
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@ Brian: I not refered to the coffin type pinplate but to a real circle formed pin plate. The oval shaped can be good but I think in normal circumstances they were rahter used on reverse planchets with also oval shaped guiding lines This instead of guide lines in a much to wide circle.
I have one of those incredible genuine looking Hitlerbewegung badges with an oval pin plate that looks vert tiny compared to the large circle lines that surrounding it. I always hoped it was a good one but chances are very low I guess. The only genuine Hitlerbewegung badges have a circle pin plate if I got it right.
@ Fuess: Congrat's with youre study of the front lettering on enamel badges in the last couple of months. You created a new tool to detect fakes.
About fakes in general: An advanced collector once told me: the Germans and the Austrians are the most dangerous fakers out there.
Regards, WimFreedom is not for FreeComment
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Hi WimOriginally posted by Wim Vangossum View Post
No, there is also a Hitlerbewegung badge with Brooch style attachment. The clue with the Hitlerbewegung badges is the letter "G" and of course both "T" letters must be the same as well. (The T in THE abbreviation FOR Österreich and the T in Hitler.)
Yes, i would agree, after all, the Germans would have been using period equipment, period attachments, period enamel and they had the know how. All this rubbish about post war fakes are easy to spot by their attachments is hocus pocus. The Enamel work on older fakes, is also correct, after all, makers like Souval were making before the war, and continued to make enameled badges for the Austrian Government right up until today. And Steinhauer, and Deschler who had mastered the art of "Faking/Reproducing" even before the Nazis were around.
Souvals article in the Austrian newspaper in 1991 says it all... "We have the equipment and materials, and we have the know how....."
But like we see here, there are now 5 and even more generation fakes, so a maker in Japan or Pakistan is copying a fake that a German maker made in the 50`s.. and because that fake from the 50`s went into collections decades ago, and is better quality than the modern fakes, ppl believe that it is original. Just look at the 1983 Cone-Head book, brand new fakes in that as real, and that was 40 years after the war!!!! so where are all the 1946-1970 fakes? Simple, in books as real, and in collections
Some dealers who planned on being around and making a living from militaria back in the day, were clever. (Both in the US and in Europe) and set themselves up like this:
A few of the reproductions were distributed amongst collectors, mainly underground in Europe as the market was not big, and back then collection nazi items was not popular or accepted like today... these items then were pictured in book as real. Later on, the fat cats released more and more, and still continue to today. That is why a "Hoard" is found every now and then, and of course all items are real because they are in books by Known people
We know what is in these books, like cones, and even the 2010 Hüsken catalog, rubbish that is what, fakes that have come to be accepted as real either by the innocent or the cunning.
It`s a dog eat dog world, and by the amount of TR militaria going around, you would think that the Wehrmacht were 100 million strong, and every SA man kept his Dagger mint at home in a box.
It is up to each person to be happy with his item, and justify the money spent on it to himself (and the wife), but most of whats about is post war, with no way of proving it is not, unless in depth study is done. And even then, there will always be an exception to the rule that makes you stop and think. But thankfully Basic facts can help us in proving lots of the good fakes to be what they are, Fake.Comment
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I agree Heim ins Reich is non period, other 2 are good.
I must say, I winced pretty bad seeing these enamels on such a rough surface, a sure way to scratch them up.Comment
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