D.V.G pin ?'s

[hdmarley]

Hello, Is this pin authentic? I have read many articles on the REDO mark. I came across this with a good feeling in a trade but just want second opinions. No loss either way! Thank you for any help provided.

Merry Christmas

hdmarley

[hdmarley]

dvg

more pics

[hdmarley]

dvg

back

[hdmarley]

dvk

back 1

[Robin Lumsden]

It's a good one !

Merry Christmas.

P.S. You aren't related to Jacob Marley by any chance ?

Maybe you should get together with 'Sscrooge' who posts here !

[hdmarley]

Dvg

Thank you Robin!! Marley is my chocolate labs name. Merry Christmas !! What are the current value on these ?

[Robin Lumsden]

What are the current value on these ?

They sell for around £45 in the UK, so I suppose that would equate to around $90 USD. It's a nice badge, and fairly scarce in good condition.

[Winterhilfswerk]

Hello
Pin is ok
Saarlautern = Saarlouis
gruss
guy

[James Noble]

Looks good from here also.
Merry Christmas

[hdmarley]

Dvg

Thank you to all that replied!!

[Martin Harding]

D.v.g

Hello, What the 'Dickens' is going on Robin, Bob croaked it centuries ago opinions appreciated on another D.V.G that I just happened to find in my jacket pocket
Regards Martin

[Martin Harding]

D.v.g

Reverse

[Winterhilfswerk]

Reverse

Hello Martin
M9/312 is Fritz Mannheim G.m.b.h from Kaiserslautern
gruss
Guy

[Martin Harding]

D.v.g

Hello Guy, thank you for the information, although I knew the maker and just wanted opinions of other members on if the Badge was authentic, as I always have items discusssed before putting them for sale on e-stand
regards Martin

[Don Scowen]

I imagine that I'm the last person you wish to respond to your question Martin, but as none of our esteemed colleagues have chosen to reply at this time I guess that I will have to.

One possible reason for the lack of replies could be due to the DVG & it's markings being controversial to say the least. They come with a variety of reverse markings, the most common being:

Redo (with or without Ges.Gesch across the bottom)
W. Redo (also with or without Ges.Gesch across the bottom)
W. Redo, Saarlautern (as seen at the top of this thread)
M9/312 (2 different maker mark styles)

Part of the controversy of this badge is that Redo continued to turn them out (& several others) for many years after the end of the war, they also used a variety of styles of maker mark both during & post period. However it is generally accepted as a quick rule of thumb that Saarlautern only appeared on the period made pieces. I could elaborate further on the possible ways of distinguishing between the various other Redo marks but that is beyond the scope of the badge being discussed here.

Most controversial of all are the badges marked M9/312.....
As you know the "M9" prefix was reserved solely for "Tages- und Festabzeichen" - Day and Meeting badges, what we call tinnies. The DVG badge is a membership or sympathiser badge, not for a specific day or celebration, so that would indicate that it should not have an RZM mark or code number on it, if however it did then it should be "M1". The RZM only marked the insignia of closely controlled NSDAP organisations (PO, HJ, SA, DAF, NSF, etc.). The DVG does not fall under this category so should not be RZM marked at all.

Some collectors state the perhaps the use of the M9 code was simply an error that was over looked, but the badge can be found with two forms of RZM code, one as you've shown above with the numbers all in a line (albeit in a slight crescent) & the other written out in a similar style as a mathematical fraction would be written, with the M9 above & to one side of the 312. If the use of the code had been an error then surly it would have been corrected when the other die was made. Stephen Lautens who has studied the RZM for years & has written an excellent book on it made some comment re RZM errors & these badges in an earlier thread.

"RZM errors (while they exist) are relatively rare....... The RZM was very strict about the use of its mark and codes. Every item to be manufactured had to be submitted in advance to the RZM and approved as a sample ("Muster"), and then only sold through RZM-approved retailers. Manufacturers had to apply for separate licenses for every type of item they made (M1 badges, M4 buckles, etc.). The penalties were severe and records indicate they were levied - fines, loss of license, even up to 2 years in jail.

The RZM's authority was well defined in a series of laws passed in late 1934/early 1935 (particularly the laws of Dec. 20, 1934 and the law of Jan. 16, 1935). It was a Party body - not government, and only controlled the insignia of some of the top three of the four levels in the NSDAP heirarchy of Party organizations. This structure was examined in detail at the Nuremberg trials from information provided by Reichsorganisationsleiter Ley and RZM chief and Party Treasurer Schwarz.

The RZM's authority under its own regulations sets out which bodies and their insignia were under its control (also shown in a list in the Jan. 16, 1935 law). The DVG is not one of these bodies and appears nowhere in these records. I have also not seen it or the badge in any of the RZM approved patterns that were issued in its manufacturer guides."

I hope that goes a little way to explain the complexities of the DVG badge & why perhaps there was no response to your enquiry.

Cheers
Don