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**Garry M.** · 10-05-2007, 08:06 AM

As you say Stu, he's clearly deluded if he thinks this badge is an original, There was no competition in this year and even if there had been, the quality of this awful badge would have led to heads rolling at the factory

If that badge appears in the catalogue then yes, a big mistake has been made. Quite how something like that can happen though is beyond me as this badge isn't even close to an original. I suspect that your seller may be talking out of his a#se... Doesn't he have a copy of the page in qusestion?

**Wim Vangossum** · 10-05-2007, 12:32 PM

Hi Stu,

I have Forman's 1st edition. On page 199 he indeed mentioned the dates: 1938,1939, 1940, 1941, 1942,1943 and 1944. The pictues on page 200 only shows a Kriessieger '38, a Gausieger 1944 and a Reichssieger 1938. However that info is a bit dated. Every serious collector is assumed to know that only the '38, 39 and '44 exist

Regards, Theo

**speedytop** · 10-05-2007, 12:36 PM

Hi.

yes, it is in the text:

Forman, Adrian, Forman's Guide to Third Reich German Awards...and their Values,
1st Edition 1988

Page 199
250. Victor's Badge in the National Trade ...
a) Kreissieger Badge with date: 1938, 1939, 1940, 1941, 1942, 1943, 1944
...
c) Gausieger Badge with date: 1938, 1939, 1940, 1941, 1942, 1943, 1944
...
e) Reichssieger Badge with date: 1928, 1939, 1940, 1941, 1942, 1943, 1944

Therefore you can produce and sell a Reichssieger from 1928 too

Regards
Uwe

**stuart a.** · 10-05-2007, 12:46 PM

hard to beleive that formans book came out in 1988 and was so wrong i would understand more if it came out in the 60`s but people still beleive what they read,but how come so much more information has come out since 88 you would think by 1988 40+ yrs after the war all the info regarding these badges would have been common knowledge or has this info only been around for the past 20 yrs
stu

**Wim Vangossum** · 10-05-2007, 01:00 PM

What could I say... Every book has its mistakes; every day respected dealers sell stuff that's not original! It's a huge task to learn everything of a selected erea of TR-awards. What do you have to know if you sell all kinds of TR- awards. Or if you sell everything from that period; from stamps to uniforms...
In my opinion it's an unpossible task. And that's way they make often mistakes.

Regards, Theo

**der-hase-fee** · 07-13-2018, 07:20 PM

Could be the same being offered again.

**Wim Vangossum** · 07-14-2018, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by der-hase-fee View Post

Could be the same being offered again.

what an ugly piece!

Regards, Wim

**Rudel** · 07-22-2018, 10:56 AM

Hi,

here is one page of the 3rd Edition.....

Kr Markus

The Badges and Documents in the National Trade Competition<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:TrackMoves/> <w:TrackFormatting/> <w:HyphenationZone>21</w:HyphenationZone> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w

oNotPromoteQF/> <w:LidThemeOther>DE</w:LidThemeOther> <w:LidThemeAsian>X-NONE</w:LidThemeAsian> <w:LidThemeComplexScript>X-NONE</w:LidThemeComplexScript> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w

ontGrowAutofit/> <w:SplitPgBreakAndParaMark/> <w:EnableOpenTypeKerning/> <w

ontFlipMirrorIndents/> <w:OverrideTableStyleHps/> </w:Compatibility> <m:mathPr> <m:mathFont m:val="Cambria Math"/> <m:brkBin m:val="before"/> <m:brkBinSub m:val="--"/> <m:smallFrac m:val="off"/> <m:dispDef/> <m:lMargin m:val="0"/> <m:rMargin m:val="0"/> <m:defJc m:val="centerGroup"/> <m:wrapIndent m:val="1440"/> <m:intLim m:val="subSup"/> <m:naryLim m:val="undOvr"/> </m:mathPr></w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--> (www.rbwk.de)

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**der-hase-fee** · 07-22-2018, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by Rudel View Post

Hi,

here is one page of the 3rd Edition.....

Kr Markus

The Badges and Documents in the National Trade Competition<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:TrackMoves/> <w:TrackFormatting/> <w:HyphenationZone>21</w:HyphenationZone> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w

oNotPromoteQF/> <w:LidThemeOther>DE</w:LidThemeOther> <w:LidThemeAsian>X-NONE</w:LidThemeAsian> <w:LidThemeComplexScript>X-NONE</w:LidThemeComplexScript> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w

ontGrowAutofit/> <w:SplitPgBreakAndParaMark/> <w:EnableOpenTypeKerning/> <w

ontFlipMirrorIndents/> <w:OverrideTableStyleHps/> </w:Compatibility> <m:mathPr> <m:mathFont m:val="Cambria Math"/> <m:brkBin m:val="before"/> <m:brkBinSub m:val="--"/> <m:smallFrac m:val="off"/> <m:dispDef/> <m:lMargin m:val="0"/> <m:rMargin m:val="0"/> <m:defJc m:val="centerGroup"/> <m:wrapIndent m:val="1440"/> <m:intLim m:val="subSup"/> <m:naryLim m:val="undOvr"/> </m:mathPr></w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--> (www.rbwk.de)

The author doesn't say that he believes the Gausieger 1942 to be an original. Unfortunately he doesn't state either that it is a fake. But he is not using that year in the listing !

**Rudel** · 07-23-2018, 03:57 AM

Originally posted by der-hase-fee View Post

The author doesn't say that he believes the Gausieger 1942 to be an original. Unfortunately he doesn't state either that it is a fake. But he is not using that year in the listing !

Yes, you are right. But people, who have little knowledge or young collecters are watching the pictures, too. And in this case, from my point of view, it is dangerous. The book is not written for a collector with a lot of experience.

Kr Markus

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