Arbeitsdienst Förderer

[williwo]

Is this an authentic badge? It´s mm RZM and 14.

[williwo]

.

[burgerhaus]

Ralf I do see it in Husken 1997 page 49 item3802i. As to whether or not it is authentic I can't say. It is a real shame that this book didn't have any reverse shots. Using logic, I would only wonder why it would have an RZM designation instead of RAD. maybe it is a transitional piece. Perhaps someone else has one to compare. Yancy might be the man. He is the RAD man. Robert

[williwo]

I found it also in the Heering/Hüsken book. And I was also wondering about the RZM mark. Waiting for more opinions.

[sjl]

The RAD was definitely not subject to the RZM - it was not a Party formation.

The badge itself looks like it comes from the earlier FAD, not RAD, and looks cast with the "14" stamped in later. The RZM mark is seriously misshapen.

I'd have to say it has my spidey-sense tingling.

[James Noble]

I believe this is a National-Sozialistischer Arbeitsdienst pin which would explain the RZM control logo. The pin williwo posted appears to have a heavy coat of lacquer on it which causes the logo and number to appear misshapen and stamped while they are actual in bas-relief like this one.

[williwo]

Aah, a matching one. Original? Everywhere I saw only the Frontside (Heering and Angolia).

[burgerhaus]

Well there we have it. James, thanks for showing. Looks like a match to me too. Robert

[sjl]

Maybe it's the laquer and light, but it looks like there is a little line below the M in the RZM logo in the first example that is missing in the 2nd one.

I've never seen anything that indicates the short-lived NSAD was under the RZM, although anything was possible in the earliest days. The FAD-RAD pre-dated Hitler and was formed as a civil organization under the Weimar republic. After 1933 it continued as a civil org and never was a "Nazi" organization.

[Radcollector]

"I've never seen anything that indicates the short-lived NSAD was under the RZM, although anything was possible in the earliest days. The FAD-RAD pre-dated Hitler and was formed as a civil organization under the Weimar republic. After 1933 it continued as a civil org and never was a "Nazi" organization"

I agree with this,i have never found any info regarding the NSAD being under RZM control.i have this same pin however mine have the 14 and the RZM mark in opposite locations.mine also came from an old coin collection as opossed to a militaria collector/dealer,i am still uncomfortable with these pins (i only paid $20 for mine so i wasnt too concerned) the front details look good however its the sloppy RZM mark that has allways been a problem for me with these.(also the fact that it is RZM marked) also the number of these pins on the market is a little suspicious to me,i see lots and that is odd for a region specific pin that couldnt have been produced in great numbers (this is a guess by me,i have never seen any printed information on the actual numbers of these produced) another thing that bothers me is a have never seen one in an old collection,i would love of someone could come up with one that they have had in thier collections since the 1960's or 1970's

[James Noble]

Just for fun lets look at this way, this is the same organization that changed it's name three times while active. First we have FAD - Freiwilliger Arbeitsdienst (Voluntary Labor Service) 1931-33 then it was named NSAD
National-Sozialistischer Arbeitsdienst (Nazi Labor Service) still voluntary but it was soon made a requirement for those wishing to study at a university or make a career in the NSDAP. Typical of the pressure used by the NSDAP to get people to join up. Then in 1935 - 45 we have RAD - Reich Arbeitsdienst (State Labor Service) it no longer was a voluntary but compulsory. So from this I would conclude that in it's history if there was a time that NSDAP had control of it then it would be while it was known as the NSAD 1933-35. I also agree that the FAD-RAD were never part of the NSDAP.

Yancy if you what to see one that's been in a collection since the early 70's look at the one I posted. Now I can't speak to what's on the market in your area but from the time I acquired mine till now I have only see two or three for sale. One last thing what is it about the RZM mark that you consider sloppy?

[Radcollector]

Hello James,

finally one from a old collection,thats solves part of the mystery,also the laquer may be why the RZM mark looks funny to me (you guys know more about pins and how they were made than i do)i will try again to take pics of mine and compare side by side with the others and see if we can notice any differences,besides the 14 and RZM mark in opposite locations,thats another thing that bothered me about mine,it has outstanding detail,everything looks correct to me but the 14 and the RZM in different spots bugs me,i have seen a few for sale like this (i have seen a number for sale in the last 2 years,i have seen them for sale at the last 2 MAX shows and at a smaller local show-if these were fakes i dont know why they wouldnt put the marks in the same spot,if you went to all that trouble getting perfect detail and the correct marks why not put them in the same spot?it would cause eye browse to raise also has anyone seen one not marked with a 14 and a RZM logo?

[Radcollector]

OK i found a thread i was looking for -this will probably add more confusion to this matter instead of solving anything but i think its a good point to bring up,if the NSAD was under RZM control why were other NSAD pins marked with RAD control marks? (what i would expect to see) we had a big discussion on these NSAD enamled badges a while back http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...highlight=NSAD

[soldon]

Here's mine with RZM and 14 on reverse -