What sort of cap badge is this

[262a]

Can anybody tell me what this cap badge was used for and is it original or just another copy

Thanks
Cliff

[DanCz]

I think maybe Hitler Youth leaders cap badge - - as to originality I cannot say for certain from the pix posted - - and anyway I am old fashioned and generally like to see items in hand before offering an opinion.

[ironfist]

Hj

I agree it is a HJ leaders one.
Missing the lover pin ,I also think it is an early one due to no RZM marking to it
so pre 36 ?? I think.
Regards Pete

[Br. James]

To me this looks like an M-34 PL cap eagle, though the finish is hard to discern, due possibly to condition or photography...or both. The M-34 cap eagle was gold in color.

What is concerning about this piece is that, while the RZM system was not yet in full operation in 1934, the logo was already in use as were some of the licensee classification numbers, and in any event, such a piece would include some reference to it's manufacturer.

Br. James

[RonR]

Cliff,

What is the wingspan measurement please?

Here is a another eagle that has a 50mm wingspan, and a similar eagle is shown as #22347 in the Assmann catalog as "NSDAP Abzeichen" and also showing it could be used for Forestry also.....

..........

[RonR]

23

[RonR]

45

[Jean-Claude]

To me this looks like an M-34 PL cap eagle, though the finish is hard to discern, due possibly to condition or photography...or both. The M-34 cap eagle was gold in color.

What is concerning about this piece is that, while the RZM system was not yet in full operation in 1934, the logo was already in use as were some of the licensee classification numbers, and in any event, such a piece would include some reference to it's manufacturer.

Br. James

Nice bird Cliff!

I agree with Br James: M 34 Political Leader type eagle even though I suppose it could have been used by other groups like Forestry as Ron mentions since a number of non NSDAP organizations had used the M 29 NSDAP style before and continued to use NSDAP (and early Army) birds until they got their own eagle design later in the 30s.

I've seen these unmarked, with the early RZM number style, and with the full (M 1 Prefix) RZM in nickel and silver washed tombac/brass but I cant say I've ever seen a gold version yet, only silver ones...From your picts, yours appears to be a nice silver tombac specimen with wear to the silver finish

I only have 2 of these: A nickel specimen with the early/short RZM # 72 (Fritz Zimmermann) and a later long form RZM M1/17 Assmann (but I cant find my back picture to show the mark) in what looks like tombac identical to the item # 22347 in Ron's picture of the Assmann catalog page

Regards

JC

[foersterBerlin]

Hi all!
The gold coloured ones were only worn by Wuerttemberg state forestry (and probably political "general´s" rank - not my field of interest). They were made of gilded tombak - extremely rare and nearly impossible to find.
Wuerttemberg forestry service wore this badge between 1935 and 1936/37 only.
Best
Stefany