Hello,
What are your thoughts on this badge... The detail looks great..
Thanks for any help.
Van
What are your thoughts on this badge... The detail looks great..
Thanks for any help.
Van
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This pic is a bit blurry, sorry.
Van -
The M1/70 is a fake.
All the accepted makers have show up together with their Bezitsurkunde the last 10 years. M1/70 is not one of them.
Regards, WimFreedom is not for FreeComment
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Are these shown in any books by any chance ?Comment
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Thanks for the help, Ill turn down the offer...
VanComment
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No, but there is an article about them (see PM)Originally posted by jack1 View Post
Freedom is not for FreeComment
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It is interesting they are all within a certain number range. Are there other makers pins numbered in the same range?
Bob HritzIn the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.
Duct tape can't fix stupid, but it can muffle the sound.Comment
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[QUOTE=Bob Hritz;7631299]It is interesting they are all within a certain number range. Are there other makers pins numbered in the same range?
Bob Hritz[/QUOTE
Yes, numbers from 8000 to 99999 exist with the accepted makers. The M1/70 has only numbers in this specific area, the others makers go over the whole spectrum from numbers as low as 85 to as high as well into the 130.000
Regards, WimFreedom is not for FreeComment
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Thank you Wim.Originally posted by Wim Vangossum View PostNo, but there is an article about them (see PM)Comment
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+1Originally posted by wim vangossum View Postthe m1/70 is a fake.
all the accepted makers have show up together with their bezitsurkunde the last 10 years. M1/70 is not one of them.
Regards, wimComment
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Bob, that is a very good question.Originally posted by Bob Hritz View Post
If there are other makers with numbers in this range I would ask that a picture of these be posted. If these duplicated numbers were already issued by M1 /70 that would be good evidence these are fakes.
In fact, does anybody have HJ badges that are in the 8000-9000 series? If so please post them. That should be an easy request to produce these if they exist. Surprise me Wim, and post one in that number range.
But until I see such proof, the M1/70's since they are made with the same workmanship, materials ans assembly as period originals, I cannot accept that they are fake.
We have not the slightlest evidence before us, that the HJ did not contract for a specific block of numbers, for whatever reason.
Somehow, all of these years we all were asleep at the switch, and somehow never noticed the M 1/70's were bad?
Another collector myth in the making, damning what could probably be authentic period badges, as fake.
And as I always point out, where are all the others? The collector shows should have them by the bushel. They don't. Ain't that the truth, Wim?Last edited by Gary Symonds; 12-08-2016, 08:42 PM.Comment
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Hi Garry,
I follow up the HJ Ehrenzeichens on forums since about 10 years now. I wrote every serial number I came across, in a list under the specific maker. After those 10 years two things became visible: 1. All the other makers M/78, 15 and M1/52 and M1/120 (except M1/49 and M1/70) are found with the matching Urkunde. I never came across an M1/70 with Urkunde. I found one M1/49 in a grouping. The M1/49 is more rare then the others so mayby one day an example turns up with the document.
2. My list of the M1/70 maker is the longest from all the makers. It came never with a document or as part of a grouping.
3. I got listed an M1/78 with the serial number 9253 and 8027. I got listed a maker marked "15" with the serial number 9461 and 9085.
I have an M1/70 in my own collection. quality wise it is perfectly made but even under magnification I can't find the slightest trace of gilding.
These are too many red flags IMO.
Years back, when I had to convince the collecting community about the fact that the M1/52 Deschler was a good original HJ Ehrenzeichen they said to me: Find evidence and we will believe you. It took a few years but then suddenly on a German forum an example popped up with the matching serial numbered document. So Garry I say the same to you: find one with the document and I will be happy to pick my M1/70 out of the drawer and put it back in my display case
Freedom is not for FreeComment
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Finding a documebt will prove nothing. I am sure there are documents in the 8000 to 9999 range, but how does that tie to a specific pin, if there are other makers in that serial number range?
Bob HritzIn the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.
Duct tape can't fix stupid, but it can muffle the sound.Comment
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I mean find an M1/70 badge with, for example, number 8900 together with the original Besitzurkunde with serial number 8900. I bet it will never turn up in the whole 8000 to 99999 range. And if you find such a document it wil be found together with an award of one of the accepted makers.Originally posted by Bob Hritz View Post
Regards, WimFreedom is not for FreeComment
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