NSKK MARINE Brown Shirt

[Barzini]

As a potential buyer, I would like to hear your opinions about this shirt please

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=814599

[Barzini]

Actually my concerns are 3

1 the shoulder board looks like to be for EM in the SA Marine; NSKK Sturmführer in Motorboot units should be made of 4 double gold cords on dark blue base, with the piping as per the associated Motorgruppe.

2 the sleeve diamond is not the specific model for Motor Boat units

3 the eagle is on the breast instead of the sleeve (left or right)

Is anybody having an explanation?

[Barzini]

also, why no collar piping?

[Pascal Bernhard]

And... The day you have to, or want to sell it, the potential buyer will ask you exactly the same questions....

Taken Individually, the indignia seems OK, but not "restaured" like this.

But it is so weirdly done that it can really be period made...

[Barzini]

taken Individually, the indignia are OK

Definitely yes, and the eagle and tabs are also quite rare

[Erich B.]

And the day you have to, or want to sell it, the potential buyer will ask you exactly the same questions....

taken Individually, the indignia are OK, but not "restaured" like this.

But it is so weirdly done that it can really be period made...

That's exactly what I thought when I first saw it. The insignia is original, it's well sewn to the shirt, the age/use shown by the insignia matches that of the shirt, and in hand there is nothing that screams out that it's been put together. I seem to remember reading that when these units were first created, there weren't clear regulations as to the insignia to be worn on the brown shirt based uniform, and that the guidelines came later (this is from memory several years ago).

Erich

[wilhelm Saris]

I seem to remember reading that when these units were first created, there weren't clear regulations as to the insignia to be worn on the brown shirt based uniform, and that the guidelines came later (this is from memory several years ago). Erich

When an arm eagle is being used it is not "when these units were first created",
but anyway about June 1939, as when the order for this type of eagle was published.

[sgstandard]

Shirt

Motor SA was absorbed into the NSKK around 1934. I've seen several "transitional" photos of them wearing NSKK collar tabs with the earlier Motor-SA bi-color collar piping, indicating "overlap" of regulations. HOWEVER......that 2nd-pattern SA shoulderboard is post-1938, and by then, the SA and NSKK were independent of each other, and regulations were pretty standardized, so why would an NSKK man still be wearing an SA shoulderboard 4 years after they weren't connected? Also, the use of both silver and gold buttons and devices combined, is completely non-regulation. But the WORST aspect of this shirt is the use of an enlisted shoulderboard with an officer rank tab, along with the aforementioned lack of collar piping, especially for an officer. Even NSKK enlisted men had collar piping. IMO, the shirt was assembled by someone who doesn't know what they were doing.

[yesthatsme]

I have personally seen this shirt in hand and that breast eagle is wonderful ...[emoji3]

[sgstandard]

Eagle

I agree that the breast eagle looks very nice. Are you suggesting that the insignia are original to the shirt, or just commenting on the eagle?

[wilhelm Saris]

I agree that the breast eagle looks very nice. Are you suggesting that the insignia are original to the shirt, or just commenting on the eagle?

The eagle should not be at the breast, but at the right upper arm!! Anyway not according 1939 regulations, as when it was introduced.

[sgstandard]

Insignia

Unless someone can explain why the shirt has an enlisted shoulderboard with officer collar tab, no collar piping, eagle in the wrong place, mixed gold/silver buttons and devices, and an SA shoulderboard on NSKK shirt 4 years after Motor-SA existed, the shirt will always be questioned. Are we expected to believe than an NSKK officer was this much of a screw-up? There's a good chance someone had the rare eagle and were desperate to use it on a shirt to turn it into a rare shirt.
PS: This is not an indictment in any way toward the seller, who may have bought it that way.

[wewelsburg]

Also why the EARLY NSKK drivers diamond?why not the later 1939 one?

[wewelsburg]

SERIOUSLY!!! this guy is selling this on estand for 2700$ and says "it has been looked at by several top political guys including a moderator on this forum and given the thumbs up. " Erich DID not give this thumbs up and neither did ANYONE HERE..someone needs to fix this on estand NOW.To discussing here.