SA brownshirt and accessories

[douglas stuart]

Hi everyone, I have been restoring a stripped late type (1939-45) SA brown shirt and thought I would show you how I have been getting on. Eventually hope to have a dagger, a kepi, and collar patches. Also if anyone has any ideas for what the missing breast badge (above the sports badge) could be (it would need to be a common sort of badge due to budget) please let me know. Any comments welcome.

I have already been told on another forum that a double claw buckle belt should be worn with a late brownshirt such as this one.

If anybody has any pictures of post 1939 SA men, I would love to see them as I can find virtually none.


Doug

[sgstandard]

Brownshirt

Good job!!
A. The belt and buckle you have there is fine. Trust me - They wore both types,
regardless of year.
B. A COTTON armband would be more appropriate for a brownshirt. The ones with the woven swastika is a good choice.
C. The SA dagger should be the later type, with RZM and Code # on blade, and the scabbard should have plated fittings (looks like chrome), not the earlier nickel fittings.
D. Necktie should have oilcloth RZM tag.
E. The collar tabs I'm posting were worn approx. between May 1941 and 1945.
This would be a good choice. Sometime in 1942, this rayon collar tab piping was discontinued, but I'm sure that those who had that, probably didn't take it off. ANY set of collar tabs that are in this format are acceptable, as long as it's a MATCHING pair. The piping around the collar tab could be either WHITE or YELLOW .
F. Collar tab pips should be silver.

[douglas stuart]

Thanks very much for your very helpful response.

With regard to the armband, the close up shows a different armband to the one on the uniform, which was still originally attached and is cotton. (the shirt had armband and buttons but everything else was missing).

[Br. James]

Hi Douglas,

Sgstandard offers some wise and experienced comments on your project. From the one photo you provide, I can't see any sign of there ever having been collar tabs on this Brown Shirt...and that would not be accurate for the SA in my experience. Also, the placement of the ribbon bar appears to be too high on the shirt; did you place this bar according to previously-made holes in the fabric or did you add it on new? And presuming that this is a late-issued SA Brown Shirt, one would want to make sure that the sport badge displayed on this shirt was the 3rd Issue SA Military Defense Badge,which was issued from January 1939 until war's end.

A great project -- congratulations,

Br. James

[douglas stuart]

Hi Br James,

Thanks very much for your comments. The brownshirt has indeed had collar tabs, there are still loose threads visible on the underside and stitching holes can be seen on close examination. The medal ribbons are in fact fixed to original loops. With regard to the sports badge, I was not aware of the different patterns and that is useful information, but presumably it would be perfectly possible for an older award to be worn on a late type shirt?

[douglas stuart]

Picture of the tie label.

[Erich B.]

The box type SA buckle was already being phased out in 1933-34 and was replaced by the open faced 2 prong buckle. Also, the cross strap fittings here are the very early pattern, which were replaced by the more familiar larger and flatter pattern. That said, I've seen a period picture of an elderly SA member instructing SS students at a school in the late 1930s who is still wearing the box type SA buckle (I believe the photo is shown in the Angolia SS insignia book). So, while uncommon to see after the early 30s, the box buckle could apparently be worn later.

Erich

[douglas stuart]

The Sports Badge.

[Erich B.]

Hi Br James,

Thanks very much for your comments. The brownshirt has indeed had collar tabs, there are still loose threads visible on the underside and stitching holes can be seen on close examination. The medal ribbons are in fact fixed to original loops. With regard to the sports badge, I was not aware of the different patterns and that is useful information, but presumably it would be perfectly possible for an older award to be worn on a late type shirt?

That's correct, and from the front side there were no discernible differences between the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd type badges.

Erich

[Erich B.]

It makes sense that the tabs were removed, as they, as well as the buttons, belt hooks if removable, shoulder board, and armband, were supposed to be removed when the shirt was laundered. This wasn't always done, but if the tabs and the board were laundered, they would lose their stiffness and tend to become misshapen.
Erich

[wewelsburg]

Makes sense tabs removed if teh stitches are broken,are they broken stitches?or can be pulled out?If tehy are 4 separate tied stitches its to decieve.

[douglas stuart]

Thanks very much for the great comments. The stitches are broken and can be pulled out.

[Br. James]

Hi Douglas,

The reverse of the Sport Badge you show in post #8 below is a private purchase example of the 2nd Issue badge. This badge was in service from February 1935 to December 1938. As I originally mentioned, if you're striving to recreate an SA Brown Shirt as it would have appeared in the late 1930s, this badge would presumably be OK, or the 3rd Issue badge mentioned previously.

I am not certain as to the rules regarding wearing a Sport Badge outside of the year in which the person earned it. It might have been something that people 'winked at' since the only way you could tell about a Sport Badge is to remove it from the shirt and look at the inscription on its reverse. Perhaps someone here will be able to add that level of detail?

Cheers,

Br. James

[sgstandard]

SA Buckles

Page 156 of Angolia's SA & NSDAP book has an excellent Post-1940 photograph to study. In the formation of SA men, of the buckles that are discernible, 2 men have claw buckles, and the other 2 have "box" buckles.
My point isn't which was more widely used, but it's enough evidence that your present buckle is appropriate. Mostly, it's a matter of preference. Be patient - the right collar tabs will pop up. Just keep checking E-stand!!