SA Treffen 1931

[Br. James]

Hi Jerry,

Jo Rivett, who uses the moniker "Josef Fuess," has been active on a number of other threads under this section heading quite recently...

Br. James

[jerry c.]

Here's the thread

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=700334

[jerry c.]

Jerry, we need more detailed pictures to be 100% sure about your badge. Post them if you can, please.
But 2nd model hollow back badges without MM have come to my hand directly from original owners´ families. I have no doubt about the authenticity of these badges, and they are widely accepted by the most renowned collectors and researchers.
Even there are shamples with MM (Poellat) but without RZM code.
If my memory don´t fail Assmann was the only one maker who marked the hollow back versions of this badge.
Only because somebody show a copy of this kind you must not condem all of them.
A lot of political medals and badges post 1935 do exist without RZM marks, and you have to know it.

[Gregorio Torres]

Dear Jerry, unfortunately yours has a lot of details wich make me think that it´s a fake.
I´m posting pictures of an original hollow back without MM and cast-iron provenance to compare.

[jerry c.]

Hmmmm. They look the same to me. Your photo is obviously much better... But they display the same detail

[sgstandard]

SA-Treffen

I used to have a badge like this in my collection, and I massively regret ever getting rid of it. The last badge posted looks exactly like the one I had. The badge in Post #33 and #34 is likely a reproduction, IMO.

[sgstandard]

SA-Treffen

PS: An interesting aspect of the 2 badges to compare - Look closely at the wreath "bow" on the viewer's lower right, on the last badge posted. Compare that wreath "bow" to the badge in Post #33. The Post#33 bow is misshapened, and almost crude, compared to the other one. Not even close, and not the workmanship you'd expect. I also don't like the reverse aging, nor the soldering on the badge in question. You often see this "light" soldering on thin tinnies, but the hollow-back Treffen tinnies are heavier, and usually had heavier soldering like the original just posted. As I recall, the one I had wasn't marked either.

[Gregorio Torres]

I used to have a badge like this in my collection, and I massively regret ever getting rid of it. The last badge posted looks exactly like the one I had. The badge in Post #33 and #34 is likely a reproduction, IMO.

I dont understand you: are you saying that the badge shown in post 34 is a reproduction?
Jerry, yours is a very good copy. As a good copy is very close to originals, but I´ll tell to you several details that I always look to identify your fake:
- The fat upper feather in the right wing
- The space between the G and the wreath, clearly visible on the reverse.
- THe eyeline going to the end of the head
- The inclination in the last lower feather on the left wing
There are a lot of other diferences but these are the most noticiable in a picture. If you´ll find these together you have a fake.
About my badge, just an observation: the pin have been period resoldered.

[Gregorio Torres]

Here you have the refered details on a picture. Note also the swaz better centered than in originals.
You can find these fakes with diferent pin and pin plates, even original pins and pin plates with MM taken from tinnies to fool to collectors.

[sgstandard]

Badge

No - The badge you posted looks fine. The previous badge that Jerry posted, is likely a repro, IMO.

[Gregorio Torres]

Ok, thank you my friend. I didn´t understand you.
I hope our contribution helps to prevent more swindles

[jerry c.]

Ok, thank you my friend. I didn´t understand you.
I hope our contribution helps to prevent more swindles

Thanks for taking the time to point out specifics.

I'll take this as a lesson learned. In replacing this in my collection in the future I think I'll stick with a solid version that can be more readily identified.