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    #1

    Early Eagle ...

    Gentlemen,

    Any opinions on this SA Eagle?
    I posted it on the SS Section but received little response.
    Perhaps this section would be more relevant as an SA / NSDAP eagle.

    Thank you,
    Mil




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    #2
    I've never seen one that wasn't stamped, so thinner and with the details of the obverse on the reverse. Plus why would the maker stamp the prongs when the eagle itself was marked?
    Erich
    Festina lente!

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      #3
      Eagle

      I don't like it either.

      Comment

        #4
        Not that I am defending this piece but just to add my own opinions:

        The details on the front are good, crisp and in line with existing examples. This is not a stamped version, and most likely cast. That would make no sense for a reproduction to be made as stamping would be far cheaper in terms of manufacturing and material.

        I have no answer to the use of stamped prongs with a marked eagle, but such stamped prongs have been known to be used. perhaps this could be a speciment or first run prototype?

        Does anyone have an M1/24 eagle for comparison? I am looking to identify if the typeface is legit.

        Mil

        Comment

          #5
          very unusual item and I rather like it. You can find original SS cap skulls that are maker marked and also stamped on the prongs

          Comment

            #6
            Eagle

            Of course, anything is possible. But I agree that there is no reason to mark the prongs on this piece. Usually prongs are marked when it's impractical to mark the item, such as SA metal collar-tab devices that are too thin to stamp. The Nazis were metallurgy experts who excelled at stamped-out badges with fine detail. When everyone else was stamping out early style SA/SS eagles, you have to ask yourself why on earth would they go through all the steps necessary to cast such an item, when you could stamp it out in a jiffy? Makes no sense whatsoever. Still voting fake here.

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              #7
              Not for me
              Mametz

              Comment

                #8
                mametz, sgstandard, what are the features that you feel uneasy about?

                Comment

                  #9
                  Eagle

                  Even if you have collected a long time, there are always new variations of original things you can come across that you haven't seen before. Having said that, if you encounter a common item that is constructed differently than all the other ones you've seen, a red flag is raised. I have sculpted and cast jewelry. The amount of time involved to produce each casting makes it impractical to cast such an item, especially considering the prevalence of stamping equipment that was used extensively in such manufacture. That's the main reason. I also don't like the RZM stamping. I realize that sometimes, on small items, the RZM logo is less than perfect, but I don't like it anyway. And, of course, the stamping is redundant. Could be real, but I highly doubt it.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Looks ok to me...dont think it was planned to stamp the prongs..looks more like"coincidence"

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Eagle

                      In over 25 years of collecting, I've never even seen an early eagle with an "M1"
                      designation. They're usually either unmarked, or have an RZM logo and/or manufacturer's number only. I've only seen the "M1" designation on the 2nd pattern SA eagle. But the method of construction bothers me even more. In the early days of the SA, most people were hardly wealthy, and stamping is much cheaper, but still with great detail.

                      Comment

                        #12
                        I don't have a M1/24 to compare this to, but....I feel it has too many red flags , and Is not IMO an original either. I'm siding with the naysayers , until such a time it can be proven by comparison to a vet provenanced eagle of the exact same die. But then again I doubt that will materialize, and It doesn't seem stamped to me either. I can't say i have any eagles at all with Rzm numbered prongs. Why number the prongs , is a good point. This one has finer details in some area, and poorer details in others where details are not necessary, but just needs to be plain. So my vote is Why don't you tell us where you came across this one? I'm curious , maybe someone brought it back from cheena. ?? I can understand why you might have fallen for it though, you're looking for rare variations......right?? Hopefully the 24 version eagles will materialize suddenly from the abyss en masse , and prove the dilema. Someones got to have some different original 24 versions. What would you say the material is made of for this eagle??
                        Last edited by juoneen; 09-10-2010, 12:15 AM.

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                          #13
                          Eagle

                          RZM logos I've seen are more like this one.....
                          Attached Files

                          Comment

                            #14
                            My other examples ...

                            First off, M1/24 with markings on body and prongs. Heavy type, semi-hollow back variant.
                            Second - Cut-thru legs with GES GESCH marking. hollow-back variant.
                            Third - RZM marked with a hard to identify numeral on the other wing. hollow-back variant.

                            Comment

                              #15

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