NSDAP Long Services Awards

[Wim Vangossum]

Hi,

This is for all who's intersted in the NSDAP Long Service Awards. As owners of boxed examples of these badges know, many times the mm on the ring is not the same as the rubber stamp on the bottom of the box. I think I may say that in general we used to put the präsidialkanzlei number on the mm we find on the cross. 2 = Juncker, 15 = Friedrich Ort and the famous mark "19" on the Golden version is atribbuted to Wiedmann.

Now there seems to exsit something as an M11/list, specially for marking the NSDAP Long Service Awards.

According to that list my mm "2" 15 year cross (I thought it was a Juncker) seems to be M11/2 which is the code for B.H. Mayer Pforzheim. The M1/130 mark on the bottom of my blue carton box makes suddely much more sense.
The famous "19" would be M11/19 which stands for Wilhelm Deumer.
I also remember a mm "15" 10 years badge in an M1/34 box. But it is not a Friedrich Orth in a Wurster box, no it's an M11/15 = Wurster in an M1/34 Wurster marked box.
The list contains more than 30 makers, but that would be no big suprise if the german assumed they would win the war.

Comments please.


Regards, Wim

[sjl]

Interesting - I've often noticed how the box stampings never seem to match the mater number.

Here is my list of M11 (and M12) RZM license numbers:

M11 – NSDAP Long Service Medals

M11/1 Steinhauer u. Lück, Lüdenscheid
M11/2 B. H. Mayers Kunstprägeanstalt, Pforzheim
M11/3 Ferd. Hoffstatter, Bonn a. Rh.
M11/4 Alfred Stübbe, Inh. H. Tegge, Berlin
M11/5 Gustav Brehmer, Markneukirchen
M11/6 Paul Meybauer, Berlin
M11/7 Foerster u. Barth, Pforzheim
M11/8 Eugen Schmidhäussler, Pforzheim
M11/9 Schwertner & Cie., Eggenberg b. Graz
M11/10 Deschler & Sohn München
M11/11 Grossmann & Co. Wien
M11/12 F. Jungwirth, Wien
M11/13 Friedrich Orth, Wien
M11/14 Gebr. Jäger, Gablonz a. N. (Sudetenland)
M11/15 Karl Wurster, Markneukirchen
M11/16 Carl Poellath, Schrobenhausen
M11/17 L. Chr. Lauer, Nürnberg
M11/18 Heinrich Ulbrichts Witwe., Kaufing b. Schwanenstadt
M11/19 Wilhelm Deumer Lüdenscheid
M11/20 F. W Assmann & Söhne, Lüdenscheid
M11/21 Josef Hillebrand, Gablonz a. N. (Sudetenland)
M11/22 Ferdinand Wagner Pforzheim
M11/23 Hans Doppler, Weis
M11/25 Fr. Keck & Sohn, Pforzheim
M11/26 Karl Pichl, Innsbruck
M11/27 Rudolf Richter, Schlag b. Gablonz a. N. (Sudetenland)
M11/28 Konrad Seiboth, Gablonz a. N. (Sudetenland)
M11/29 Simet & Co., Wien
M11/30 Rudolf Souval, Wien
M11/31 Carl Wild, Hamburg
M11/32 Oswald Posselt, Gablonz a. N. (Sudetenland)
M11/33 Fritz Zimmermann, Stuttgart
M11/34 Frank & Reif, Stuttgart
M11/35 Argentor-Werke, Rust & Hetzel, Wien
M11/36 Richard Simm & Söhne, Gablonz a. N. (Sudetenland)
M11/39 Karl Hensler, Pforzheim


M12 – NSDAP Long Service Medals (Miniature)

M12/l Hymmer. & Co., Lüdenscheid
M12/2 Petz & Lorenz, Unterreichenbach
M12/3 Apreck & Vrage, Leipzig
M12/5 Julius Bauer Söhne, Zella-Mehlis
M12/6 Adam Donner, Wuppertal-Elberfeld
M12/7 Friedrich A. H. Meyer, Berlin-Friedenau
M12/8 E. Harbrecht-Baun, Stuttgart
M12/9 Otto Schickle, Pforzheim
M12/10 Boerger & Co. Berlin
M12/11 Eduard Schiffer, Bielefeld
M12/12 Theodor Schulz, Schalksmühle
M12/13 Schauerte & Höhfeld Lüdenscheid
M12/14 Alois Rettenmaier, Schwäbisch-Gmünd
M12/15 Albert vom Hofe, Lüdenscheid
M12/16 P. Sandig & Co., Liegnitzer Silberwarenfabrik, Liegnitz
M12/17 Funke & Bruninghaus, Lüdenscheid

[Wim Vangossum]

Indeed there are a lot of so called mixed medals and boxes. Too much imo. I already found out that in three such cases it was only correct when using the M11/ list and I bet there be much more.

And logically thinking it would be strange to link Präsidialkanzlei codes to a pure NSDAP award, no?

I found the same list as yours in the second edition of German Medal Makers and Their Marks: . http://www.mwmilitaria.co.uk/book/advert.htm written by M.J. Woods.

Regards, Wim

[der-hase-fee]

Just for easy reference: http://www.germancombatawards.com/th...&hilight=nsdap

[Wim Vangossum]

Just for easy reference: http://www.germancombatawards.com/th...&hilight=nsdap

I started the discussion of the wrong maker designations on the GCA. If I look back at this older thread now, I see how wrong we were there with linking makers on all these badges.


Regards, Wim

[der-hase-fee]

15 year award with short legged font

I do have a problem with the 15 year awards with the strange - or maybe special or just different ? - font, one now being offered on e-stand:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=444887

Compared to other examples, the "f" and the second leg of the "h" do not reach down far enough.

This may be just a maker variance, but I haven't seen a conclusive discussion on this yet.

[Hansi]

It´s just a maker variance. Nothing else.
There are also other makers, who have this kind of font.

Hansi

[Stan]

NSDAP Cross

This appears to be the type with a flaw at the top of the left wing and a different style eagle's head.

On GCA this style has so far been attributed to Hauptmuenzamt Wien. I have a similar 25-Yr Cross which is shown on another thread.

Stan

[Tom Yanacek]

Great information in this thread!

So this NSDAP 15-Year LS Cross, marked with a '2' on the suspension ring is in reality an RZM M11/2, which is attributed to B.H. Mayer of Pforzheim and not C.E. Juncker of Berlin. Makes complete sense now.

Thanks & best regards,
Tom

[Tom Yanacek]

reverse:

[ErichS]

Great information in this thread!

So this NSDAP 15-Year LS Cross, marked with a '2' on the suspension ring is in reality an RZM M11/2, which is attributed to B.H. Mayer of Pforzheim and not C.E. Juncker of Berlin. Makes complete sense now.

Thanks & best regards,
Tom

Nice Tom, mine is also marked 2 like yours. I think that it was made by Juncker.

[jabnus]

How about a list of makers of the boxes?

I have a M1/154 Silver case, unknown to me...


best regards,
Gaston

[Peter J.]

Stephen, it's interesting to notice that non of the firms producing the full sized version made any miniatures and vice versa.

cheers
Peter

[Tom Yanacek]

Nice Tom, mine is also marked 2 like yours. I think that it was made by Juncker.

Hi Erich,

Thanks, but it does not appear that Juncker made these. The '2' in this case is not a Präsidialkanzlei Lieferant number because NSDAP items were not marked with a Lieferant number: NSDAP items were controlled through the RZM and therefore given an RZM number. Manufacturers of NSDAP Long Service Decorations were assigned an RZM M11/ code where the 'M' means metal goods producer and the '11' means NSDAP Long Service Decorations. The number following the '/' would then correspond to the actual manufacturer. The RZM code number of M11/2 was assigned to B.H. Mayer so an NSDAP LS Decoration with a '2' stamped on the ring is actually a Mayer not Juncker. Lieferant numbers and RZM numbers are two completely different things and not interchangeable.

Best regards,
Tom

[sjl]

The M11 license category was created May, 1940, and the M12 category specifically for miniatures three months later in August 1940.

It appears the makers jumped on quickly, as I have mini stickpin versions marked "M11/1", which was correct until the new category came out three months later.

Here is a 9mm stickpin with the M12 prefix:



And here are the 15 and 25 year 11mm minis with the M11/1: