A couple of Cultural items

[Thorsten B.]

And some examples for the household - stunning Irminsul design to the left.

[Thorsten B.]

Wrought iron wedding candleholder - a very detailed and skillful piece:

[Thorsten B.]

Candlelight on top - heart and arrow in the middle - eternal chain at the bottom.

[Thorsten B.]

There were also variations with sun wheels and runic symbols manufactured - all in the identical style and size, Hermann Historica sold a few of them in one of their past auctions within the SS section.

Height of this one is nearly 17 cm.

[Anthony Evans]

Anthony,

Some people want focus on purely items that the SS used in their SS cultural activities and others like to also look at the bigger cultural changes of which the SS were involved in.

If you look in the Weitzel book which you collect, you see both. What you can say is purely SS, an item such as the Julleuchter, its stands upon a DHW chest and also in front of a tapestry of the type the DHW sold. These items are linked by Weitzel himself in his book and therefore presents us with clear and pictured link between DHW and the SS. What we also see from these pictures that Daniel and I have shown is that the very same items, ie the tapestry and the DHW furniture the SS are effectively recommending to the SS membership are also available to the greater public.

Some of us like to look at the big picture of the SS involvment in the cultural movements in the Third Reich. The pictures are from period design magazines printed in the Third Reich showing the trends of the time and so an important resource in learning what exactly was available, surely valuable information whether you look at the smaller SS picture or the greater German cultural picture.

You present some nice items here and it would seem you like only the smaller picture, that's fair enough but there is no need to be disrespectful to other members greater German cultural interests with the sarcasm of the flea market and elderly comment.

Ok we can look at the big picture, then by your logic a picture of Adolf hitler is also considered SS culture since it is on the 1st photo of a wood cabinet. I agree the dhw items are nice and from the 3rd reich period. But as Thorsten was nicely to post they were used by all factions of the reich not just the SS. As per Minnesinger's photo does it cover the living quaters of other military branch members? And was not trying to insult any one's items but as mentioned 2 sentences before they could have been used by almost anyone with in the reich.

[Thorsten B.]

Anthony,

Maybe we need to clear something:

I provided pics of a booklet from the most important provider (manufacturer) of illumination in the Third Reich which was not the DHW.
This firm producing cultural lamps, candelabers and candleholders provided - as you have seen - all kinds of TR official organisations including SS.

That means that - as one example - this firm was THE trendsetter and leader of design within it´s field and they executed one-of-a-kind pieces on special order (for special persons or special buildings/locations), for named parts of the period system including the SS.

There were inner SS core pieces, yes, but they could not function and fulfill their whole meaning and order just via these inner core pieces - and even then these core pieces could be provided by one and the same firm which also provided another branch of the system like the HJ or Marine with their core pieces within their possible fields of production range, light systems in this case.

An SS officer could not just sit or sleep or cook on his Julleuchter in his house, he needed a chair, and a closet, many different pieces of furniture, decorative objects, lamps, other candleholders, a bed or two, a room and stuff for his children - he needed a concept of living, a concept of beliefs, he ought to live his beliefs, daily and in eternity.

All this facets could only provide and enable that concept by working together, by sharing, by dividing and occupying their fields of interest and skills.

So each branch/product group represents a circle and in the middle of that circle are their core products/pieces and at the spot where all these circles not only come close to each other but represent an overlapping of pictures - there they start to come to sense and life and get melted to become one.

And that is how it worked and was supposed to work, they simply complement and need each other, need the big picture, need to be seen as one.

[Steve T]

Ok we can look at the big picture, then by your logic a picture of Adolf hitler is also considered SS culture since it is on the 1st photo of a wood cabinet. I agree the dhw items are nice and from the 3rd reich period. But as Thorsten was nicely to post they were used by all factions of the reich not just the SS. As per Minnesinger's photo does it cover the living quaters of other military branch members? And was not trying to insult any one's items but as mentioned 2 sentences before they could have been used by almost anyone with in the reich.

Yes, for sure DHW was available to anyone, I also said that well before the Thorsten post you mention.

Regarding logic, no I'm not applying any logic to every single item in the picture, that's not what I said. What I said was 'What we also see from these pictures that Daniel and I have shown is that the very same items, ie the tapestry and the DHW furniture the SS are effectively recommending to the SS membership are also available to the greater public.' , note emphasis on tapestry and DHW.

Then 'Some of us like to look at the big picture of the SS involvment in the cultural movements in the Third Reich. The pictures are from period design magazines printed in the Third Reich showing the trends of the time and so an important resource in learning what exactly was available, surely valuable information whether you look at the smaller SS picture or the greater German cultural picture.' which says general trend, valuable information, what was available. So this period documentation is a useful resource to review and helps build a better picture, you still have to use your head and interpret it, I'm not suggesting there is a logic for us to follow that explains every item.

Fair enough you didn't mean the comment in the way I took it, I couldn't see how flea markets and homes for the elderly related to the post, but no problem.

As for your question, 'As per Minnesinger's photo does it cover the living quaters of other military branch members?'. Does what cover other branches? Perhaps ask Daniel, he may have his copy of the article to hand as he just posted it.

[Martin Frohberg]

Hi all,
Wonderful thread and really interesting to read! I have spent a full week of reading and I'm really enjoying myself

Sometimes the logic is clear and sometimes not. An example:

If you find a reich pfennig from 1937, there is a small chance Adolf Hitler had it in his pocket. Is it right to call it a AH pfennig then? Maybe, maybe not!

Well, thats just my humble opinion and contributon to this wonderful thread! Keep the good stuff commin' Thorsten and Steve and everybody else
Your knowledge are awsome

/Martin

[Minnesinger]

Ok we can look at the big picture, then by your logic a picture of Adolf hitler is also considered SS culture since it is on the 1st photo of a wood cabinet. I agree the dhw items are nice and from the 3rd reich period. But as Thorsten was nicely to post they were used by all factions of the reich not just the SS. As per Minnesinger's photo does it cover the living quaters of other military branch members? And was not trying to insult any one's items but as mentioned 2 sentences before they could have been used by almost anyone with in the reich.

The photo I posted was from an article about a house that was under SS-controll. It names a single firm responsible for all interior decorating there. If they did work for DAF, RAD or what ever it may be I don't know.

[Dmv]

Bought this one on ebay.com. Didn't you guys spot it?

Some of sellers description:

"For sale is this 100 percent authentic, German oak wood bread plate. It was made in 1941.
The plate displays a wonderful antique sword as it was used in prehistoric times (perhaps the bronze age), or in imaginated Germanic past, and the year 1941.
The egde of the plate is incribed with the North-West German ( East Frisian ) saying LEVER DOT AS SKLAV – what means LIEBER TOT ALS SKLAVE / BETTER DEAD THAN SLAVE. The use of Frisian dialect shows us that this plate comes from the very Northern edge of Germany - Friia.
The saying, sometimes written Lever dood as Slaav, was used for centuries to express a strong demand for freedom and independence. Here, it appears in a new, NS related context. The local tradition and identity is mixed with actual war politics. This bread plate is quite rare was probaly made for a German / Netherlands XX marriage couple. "


I found this German/Fries song :

Hier herrschte nie die Frone
Hier war der Bauer Graf
Wo aller Friesen Wahlspruch
Ist: lever dot als Slav

source: http://www.nordwestreisemagazin.de/m...kolonisten.htm

"Die armen Menschen, die in Friesland wohnten, wurden von den reichen Bauern als Sklaven benutzt, denn sie bekamen wenig Lohn für die schwere Arbeit, die sie verrichteten. Sie dachten sich: Lever dot als Slav. (Das heißt: Lieber tot, als ein Sklave zu sein.) "
source: http://www.geschichtsatlas.de/~gb32/...neration1.html

[Thorsten B.]

Very nice plate.

That reminds me of something in my collection from Friesland, a wall plate (better to say decorating medaillon) with diameter of 48 cm.

[Thorsten B.]

The Rüstringer Friese:

[Thorsten B.]

Haus Westfalen

One of the biggest SS cultural items worldwide for sale:

http://www.goetz-immobilien.de/angebote.php?k=1&onr=222

[Jack83]

One of the biggest SS cultural items worldwide for sale:

http://www.goetz-immobilien.de/angebote.php?k=1&onr=222

Fake. Obviously you built the whole house in your wood shop and then moved it to Neubrandenburg!

[Thorsten B.]

Damned - you got me there.

Here´s another enlightenment: