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**GaPawn** · 03-27-2015, 04:14 AM

Where could I find a list of dates/locations for these shows? I am not too far from Atlanta, so I would assume one would eventually be in my area. We have highly advertised "gun shows" every couple or three months, but I have never seen a military memorabilia show advertised around here.

I obviously don't run in the right circles.....

**Matthew** · 03-27-2015, 06:00 PM

more pics?

I'd say you found a right place to find more info about your medal right here. My experience with those never went past the general admiration stage so I can not help you myself but scrolling through different threads on them- there are a handful of collectors with much needed expertise here. Hopefully they will decide to partake in this discussion. You can also run a search yourself using the 'search' function in the top right of your screen for keywords (Order of the dead, German order, etc).
Gun and Military Shows are a fantastic places to buy, sell and socialize with like minded collectors but to get a background info on rare medals- probably would not be my first choice.
And judging by the quality of material you posted so far- I'd say it's the rest of us who don't run in the right circles- many can only dream of owning the piece you show so you're doing just fine IMO.

cheers

Matt

**ErichS** · 03-27-2015, 06:46 PM

I'm also a novice regarding these rare awards. Some say the originals are made of silver while others say that they are made of tombak. I'm always interested in learning more about these altra rare awards.

**DTS** · 03-27-2015, 09:49 PM

Originally posted by Military View Post

GaPawn, my advice is not to clean the medal. Leave it as it stands. I would suggest that you might want to bring it with you to a militaris fair (SOS/MAX) and have it appraised by one of the big boys at the show. Mil

Beware. They'll tell you it's a fake. Then offer you $1000 for it because "you're a nice guy" and they need a place keeper.

Next time you see them, they're driving a new Porsche. Or two.

**Stan** · 03-28-2015, 05:36 AM

I also think that this cross stands a good chance of being original and you can tell from the suspension loop that it is made of tobak and not silver, as it should be.

Good front and back photos of the cross are definitely required together with dimensions.

Photos of the case would also be very interesting.

As Matt said, a very exciting find.

Stan

**Br. James** · 03-28-2015, 08:21 AM

Another unique quality of this award is the designer's use of the Golden Party Badge as it's centerpiece. Other than the GPBs themselves, this is the only example of a GPB design used for an award or decoration. As I understand it, the sole manufacturer of the German Order was the firm of Wilhelm Deumer of Lüdenscheid. Of significant related interest is the use of the Josef Fuess design of the GPB in this award's motif...not the more common design manufactured by Deschler and Son. While the German Order's centerpiece GPB is slightly smaller than the small GPB, the design is clearly that of the badge bearing the Fuess name.

While the Deschler firm was capable of turning out the GPB in volume, apparently Josef Fuess was a local Munich jeweler and designer whose business was too small to directly manufacture and finish a GPB design, so there is the logical possibility that while Fuess produced the design for his version of the GPB, it was actually made by another firm or sub-contractor. And so we come to Wilhelm Deumer and his firm's German Order, the only other representation of either design of the GPB.

I think I'll leave it there...for the moment, at least! A wonderful piece!

Br. James

**GaPawn** · 03-28-2015, 01:08 PM

Thanks for all the wonderful info so far!!!!

I will try to track down the case, ASAP. But with working 6 days/60+ hours/week, and church on Sunday's, my available digging time is pretty limited. Once I have located it, I will try to get some good pics so that I may document this Order, and it's case, for the forum. I'm assuming this thread is the best place to continue these discussions since it was started for the "German Order--2nd Class Neck Order," which is what this is, though of a slightly different type than what the OP posted.

I am in the process of trying to determine which unit my Great-Uncle was in during the war, on the U.S. side, so that some sort of educated guess, as to how he acquired it, might be made. Any suggestions, links, or help in tracking down this unit info would be appreciated!!! It is very gratifying to finally find out that this award, which I have treasured for decades, has some historical significance and value. Now that I know just what I have, it gives me a starting point, and a reason, to begin research. If only I had known of it's significance while my Great-Uncle Harold was still alive.....

I am looking forward to sharing any and all info that I can ascertain, concerning this particular Order, with the forum. Thanks again, for all of y'all's interest, help, and suggestions to date!!! What a wonderful resource this is, with first class members, that I have been lucky enough to finally stumble across!!! As always, any questions or suggestions are welcomed with open arms.

Steve

**Tony T-S** · 03-29-2015, 03:46 AM

Wow, what a find. You'll see the long thread on these among the stickies at the head of this forum. I can't wait to see more photos of it.

**Br. James** · 03-29-2015, 08:15 AM

Hi Steve,

You might not want to put too much stock in discovering where your great-uncle served during WWII -- with the amount of bartering for 'war trophies' that went on during those years, to say nothing of gambling debts, a 'Nazi souvenir' could easily make its way from city to city all across Germany, in almost no time flat!

Cheers,

Br. James

**GaPawn** · 03-30-2015, 05:25 PM

Thanks for the heads-up on the pinned thread Tony!!!! What a marathon read THAT was!!! A LOT of good info in there!!! I thought I might want to change over and post in there, but it's kind of a train wreck, and since I've already started here, unless y'all think I should move over to there, I'm kinda comfortable right here.....

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Br. James..... gambling debts? Whatever could you be referring to????

Had you met Uncle Harold???? Right after the war for a couple of decades he and my Grandpa raised game cocks..... But I'm sure Uncle Harold would NEVER gamble...... he retired as a High School principal.....

Yeah, good point, the story about getting it off of a surrendering "high government official" ~may~ well have been passed along with the Order, whilst he was raking in his winnings! LOL

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Still eyeballing the closet where the safe is, inside which I believe (99%+ certain) the case for the Order to be. I'll make myself tackle that soonest, then get mo betta pics for y'all.

**Chris Obermeyer** · 03-30-2015, 05:44 PM

Sorry but it is a fake. Please for real detailed information read the pinned thread above
.

**GaPawn** · 03-30-2015, 11:07 PM

Opinions are like, uhhhhh, noses.....
Everybody's got one!

You are entitled to yours, and the rest of the forum is entitled to theirs. Unless they began making fakes in 1945ish you might want to keep your opinion to yourself, to keep from looking too foolish. You see, I happen to know the history of this piece, as it's been in my family since then.

Or, perhaps it's my dearly departed Great Uncle Harold, a retired rural high school principal, raiser of game cocks, bird dogs, and mink, who secretly created all these "fake" German Orders that keep popping up on this forum, in order to become filthy rich by duping experts all over the world with these really bad "fake" Orders! Cuz the one he gave my Grandmother when he got back frm the war, is a dead ringer for all the other "fakes" that you keep calling out.

Funny thing, but after repeated requests by MANY forum members, I've yet to see you post a picture of your "real" order, or rather any one your friend's MANY "real" Orders, as the case may be.

Nice try, but I'll not rise to the bait, TYVM.

Additional pictures of my "fake" Order ASAP.

**Bob Coleman** · 03-30-2015, 11:18 PM

" CAN'T PLEASE EVERYONE SO YOU GOT TO PLEASE YOURSELF"
Ricky Nelson

**Chris Obermeyer** · 03-31-2015, 11:08 AM

Originally posted by GaPawn View Post

Opinions are like, uhhhhh, noses.....
Everybody's got one!

You are entitled to yours, and the rest of the forum is entitled to theirs. Unless they began making fakes in 1945ish you might want to keep your opinion to yourself, to keep from looking too foolish. You see, I happen to know the history of this piece, as it's been in my family since then.

Or, perhaps it's my dearly departed Great Uncle Harold, a retired rural high school principal, raiser of game cocks, bird dogs, and mink, who secretly created all these "fake" German Orders that keep popping up on this forum, in order to become filthy rich by duping experts all over the world with these really bad "fake" Orders! Cuz the one he gave my Grandmother when he got back frm the war, is a dead ringer for all the other "fakes" that you keep calling out.

Funny thing, but after repeated requests by MANY forum members, I've yet to see you post a picture of your "real" order, or rather any one your friend's MANY "real" Orders, as the case may be.

Nice try, but I'll not rise to the bait, TYVM.

Additional pictures of my "fake" Order ASAP.

Do you reallty think that Mr. Aylson Doyle is going to give his reasearch he gathered for decades like that, for nothing? He açready gave enough information that proves and expose those fakes and "experts" that for whatever reason said for years those bronze type were real. Would you give these info for free?

**GaPawn** · 03-31-2015, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by Chris Obermeyer View Post

Do you reallty think that Mr. Aylson Doyle is going to give his reasearch he gathered for decades like that, for nothing? He açready gave enough information that proves and expose those fakes and "experts" that for whatever reason said for years those bronze type were real. Would you give these info for free?

Posting a picture is not giving away research.

So you (and he) are saying that there was a thriving market for fakes in the 1940's? I find that difficult to believe.

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