Fake photos by using vintage photo paper?...or something like this?

[Desertfarbe]

Hi Folks!

Just wondering if anybody of you came across fake photos...

I guess professional photographer could use NOS photo papers or todays repro look a like ones and reproduce genuine vintage photos(by using original negatives or taking new pics of genuine pics and so on...)...
So this way the final product could look like vintage and genuine to inexperienced eyes...

Is this just a silly thought or did you experience something like this?

At this days...everything is possible...

What about vintage look a like photos without "vintage smell" on them?

For istance:

Todays Ukraina watchmakers use to reproduce fake Luftwaffe watches by using original period pocket watch movements and re made the dials...
Could they also reproduce fake vintage photos by using vintage photo paper (for istance "Agfa Brovira" or similar)?

Tell me what you think...


Thanks in advance...

[12thPanzer]

Hi Desertfarbe,
There are a bunch of ways they fake these photos. The most dangerous IMO are the ones that are printed modernly (some from the negative) on wartime paper or wartime lookalike paper. The latter being easier to spot of course. You see them a lot on Ebay, sometimes with fake atelier stamps. And I have no shame in admitting, over time Ive personally bought some and didn't know until I got em in hand that something wasn't right. Good to have as references to help others if for nothing else...

[Desertfarbe]

Hi Desertfarbe,
There are a bunch of ways they fake these photos. The most dangerous IMO are the ones that are printed modernly (some from the negative) on wartime paper or wartime lookalike paper. The latter being easier to spot of course. You see them a lot on Ebay, sometimes with fake atelier stamps. And I have no shame in admitting, over time Ive personally bought some and didn't know until I got em in hand that something wasn't right. Good to have as references to help others if for nothing else...

Hi 12thPanzer!

This is actually what I meant...

What do you think about these two pics I got?

These were stated as 100% genuine and from a private collection...

Photo A:




Photo B:




My considerations:

No "vintage smell" on them...so just wondering if this is possible if photos have been stored in a good way...

I don't know how genuine "Agfa Brovira" paper looks like...so I don't have any to compare to these...

Referring to the stain on the photo "A"...:

In my opinion...neither a print( because stain is present either on the front and on the back)...nor a photo of a photo...
So I guess a genuine vintage "Agfa Brovira" paper with old stain in it...or a "genuine" modern look-a-like paper...

At this point we can consider this photo:


- a modern print on vintage paper...

or

-a modern print on vintage look-a-like paper...

or

-totally genuine (both paper and photo itself) wartime private photo...(as I really hope!!!)


As I said I don't know how this paper should be made to be called a genuine one...but seems to be made of at least two layers...
The first one where the stain is on...and the second one as top covering surface...
Actually if I let the light come over the photo I can see the surface in perfect with no corruption into the stain area...

And what about the "Agfa Brovira" marks on the back?
They could be genuine...but made at that time or todays with genuine stamps?

And what about "Adolf Galland" name on it?
If genuine...should be made with a stamp or with a typewriter?

So many questions...

I'd like to consider these two pics genuine...but I guess I'll never be 100% sure about this...as long as I'll bring them to a vintage photo expert to be carefully examined...

I can also say that:

-the size of each photo is different from the other...so this could be a nice point not to think about fake...

-I didn't see any photo like these on the web,ebay or book yet...So they could be actually genuine private photos...


Anybody of you have photo exactly like these just to disprove my theory?


Thanks for your opinion...

[Thomas H]

Hi Desertfarbe,

I'm sorry to bring you bad news, but both photos are modern reproductions.

I don't think that they are made on original pre 1945 Agfa paper, but maybe I'm wrong there. It is not so hard to print/stamp Agfa on a piece of paper.

They look like typical "Russian Archive" photos to me; they just miss that stamp on the back.

Galland name printed or stamped is not making any photo real or fake.

I don't have any doubts with these two photos. They are modern reproductions and to me it is rather easy to see that. It is the yellow/brown look and the lack of sharpness. Therefor I don't have to wonder about smell, stains, printed/stamp paper maker or other info.

They could be 20years old reproduction.

Good luck with collection and I hope next time you have more luck!

Kind regards, Thomas

[Desertfarbe]

Hi Thomas!

I was afraid about this...as I imagined...

Pics are not too bad...They have a good sharpness...as you can see...(although not a good scan ...)
For istance the "spaces" all along the rifle barrel and the two seagull on the collar tab...are sharpened...




The thing that make me think is another...and so the presence of what it seems a "squared paper" below the photo...a good reference to set straight a pic to make a photo of a photo...






Not too bad....I just paid them 9.99usd each...


What do you mean here?

They look like typical "Russian Archive" photos to me; they just miss that stamp on the back.

Do you mean these kind of pics should have stamped "Russian Archive" on it"? or this is just a funny way to say they are fake?


The seller from Ukraina said these are from a private collection...so I guess a Russian Archive for sure...



Thanks for your opinion....


Cheers!

[Andrew Harris]

Do you mean these kind of pics should have stamped "Russian Archive" on it"? or this is just a funny way to say they are fake?

Thery are just modified "Russian Archive" fakes. Instead of stmaps fakers add "Agfa-Brovira" or "Agfa-Lupex" logos. Already discussed on forum.

Rostyslav.

[Desertfarbe]

Hi Rostyslav!

Thanks to confirm this...

I got them on ebay...I know either the name of the seller and the potential faker...

Actually the sender name on the envelope was not the one of the seller but another one...
So I just "googled" this name and got that this name should own to a professional photographer in Kyev...

So 1+1= 2....

After saying this to the seller he disappeared into the nowhere...

They are not so smart as they think...


Next time ....before buying something like this...I'll post them here...
As I did with LW gloves...boots...breast eagle....EK II Klasse...and so on...

Our Forum is definitely very helpful!!!


Thanks to all!!!

Cheers!

[Desertfarbe]

Good news...

The seller just came back to me...and refund me 15usd(I asked a partial refund to consider these photo not original but copies)...He is really sorry ...and he is investigating about the photos...
I really don't know if he is playing a game or not...if he is honest or not...

Anyway at this point I can say I purchased two repro pics at a resonable price...

As I wrote before....next time...I'll post here photos before purchasing them...

Thanks again to all...

Cheers!