SS-EK1 document

[andrewb]

Next 12 of the RK doc with Tychsen, Lammerding and Hausser signatures.

RK1.

[andrewb]

Rk2.

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Rk.3

[andrewb]

RK.4 Still on front page. Tychsen sig.

[andrewb]

Rk.5

[andrewb]

Rk.6

[andrewb]

RK.7 Lammerding sig.

[andrewb]

Rk.8

[andrewb]

Rk.9

[andrewb]

Rk.10

[andrewb]

Rk.11 Hausser sig.

[andrewb]

Rk.12

[andrewb]

I wil post this last additional photo of the RK doc page 2 & 3. If you would like more photos please ask.

All comments all welcomed. Thanks for looking.

Regards,
AB

[Mark C. Yerger]

My 2 scans were just to compare signatures, as well as explain what I got from BDC.

Better experince than me is needed for other aspects or determination. If they are bad, somebody did a lot of research and effort, that's rare in general.

In dealing with all the GC Vorschlag copies for my book series you find so many different copies, form types, out of sequence numbers, multiple different cover sheets, multiple times sent at different times with same text but other signatures, it's enough to drive you nuts.

But those copies I got match by date, making the whole thing odd. I would think a man would (should) only sign the inner cover when sub-unit level submitted by him and then the a different final cover that was normal initialled approved, if the situation dictated he moved from element to division commander at that exact time. Have seen one such Vorschlag but don't recall top of my head who it was.

While the divisional commander's signed cover or page was normally what ended up being initialed by Kment, plently by lower level commanders can be found to add to the frustration. In my "Nordland" volume are 2, one signed by a battalion commander and one by a regimental commander. Neither had a secondary (lower) or higher (divisional commander) cover sheet as far as I know. Seems odd to me a battalion commander would have the juice to directly send such a document, maybe cover parts were missing or thrown away for whatever reason before final approval.

But in mid-July 1944 it would not have been Tychsen (in 2 diffrent positions) signing as "Divisionsführer" or i.V., his brief command was later in the month, and the doc shown (elaborate cover lettering) is normally the final outside cover type. But as I've said, not always. Have seen several (GC and Honor Clasp) where the lower submitting level used the "fancy" form. But Lammerding's signature as leader of the division is on the Kment initialed approved cover for the KC.

Enough to drive you crazy.

Not being a forgery expert or experienced in other aspects of document collecting, when originally posted I assumed both were good due to right dates, stamps, general visual, etc, all of which is a lot more than fakers bother to know or care about. Being my favorite division, when I saw them I wished I owned them.

Sorry for not providing more than several "where there is a rule, here is an exception" comments and a couple scans. Finally, I've seen Tychsen's signature vary at different times, I always assumed due to so many wounds and recovery periods.

Just my 2 cents worth of donation. Being the direct connection to a high award, these Vorschlag documents are FAR more desirable to me than any hat, insignia, or similar.

[andrewb]

Hi Mark and thanks for replying.
The DKiG doc has only Ostendorff signing it both front page and back whereas the RK doc has Tychsen sig on front and then the 2 higher ranks sig inside.

You are so right in saying that if they are fake then a hell of a lot of work, time and research has gone into it but you must have it in your hand to get the true look and feel of it. Both docs are very fragile and as you can see some of the stamps have faded. In some parts the typing has gone through the page. The outer and inner of the docs have yellowed more so than the middle. Not sure how one fakes that.

The Lammerding sig does look different to your one but it could be due to the circumstance or situation he was under at the time of signing. Or it's a fake! I don't know but I do know that the docs look and feel as real as can be. They have been seen by 2 well known dealers and both like them. That may or may not mean much. I'm not trying to convince myself of anything just stating the facts.

I will wait and see what the other members here have to say with these close-up shots.

Regards,
AB.