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**Rick Research** · 06-22-2001, 11:23 AM

What sort of "documents" are you trying to read? We are a veritable U.N. in here of linguistic skills....

**Sebastian Bianchi** · 06-22-2001, 11:29 AM

I had the same problem and I was unable to find a program that would leave me totally satisfied. They would give me an idea of what the document was or the jist of the letter but still left me feeling like something was missing. As Rick mentioned the forum does have some good individuals who might be able to help to a degree but then again you can’t run over every single time you need something. So my solution was a compromise of both – for big items I have someone who helps professionally (thanks also to a recommendation of a forum member), and for smaller things some friends who help out.

Seba

**RJB** · 06-22-2001, 09:30 PM

What program are you using Seba? The one I'm using is junk, you can type in a few sentences and it'll only pick up a couple of words.

I have 20 pages worth

. My girlfriend bought me a lot off Jamie Cross, of a KVK2 citation + 20 letters to do with a Leutnant D.R. Ernst Topfer. You might have seen it on his web site. The words that the program does translate suggest that he get involed in a card accident with an army lorry, and is in a bit of trouble for it, but thats all I can tell.

**Sebastian Bianchi** · 06-22-2001, 10:51 PM

I was actually just using Altavista.com, it is free and it's ok. Like I said though, I had to get them done by a pro anyway. Actually, the story I have will be on-line soon. I find these personal accounts of the war very interestering and rewarding to research.

Seba

**SMFlagg** · 06-22-2001, 11:18 PM

The German language has changed in the past fifty years. As can be expected, the type of hand writing has also changed having come from more script-like to more defined block letters. The German language is currently cut into "old-German" and "new-German." I, for one, have learned the newer type of German and do have difficulty translating WWII era documents. I guess this can be compared with the way some English phrases have come into use over the past few decades that never would have been used 60 years ago.

Steve

**Rick Research** · 06-23-2001, 12:40 AM

Jeez, now I REALLY feel ancient. I grew up writing the old pre-1945 script from old text books lying around at home. My first German homework assignment in college, the Prof wanted to know who "the old man" was in our sea of pimply faces.

But what's all this about COMPUTER translating--what do you do, svcan it in and it does it for you? I just use my BRAIN, such as it is!

Oh well, at least even I can't read pre-revolution Russian Old Church Slavonic!! (Or hieroglyphics

)

[ 22 June 2001: Message edited by: Rick Lundstrom ]

**RJB** · 06-23-2001, 02:08 AM

The Altavista program works better, you can get an idea of whats going on. But its still pretty poor.

Rick, you go to a web site such as www.altavista.com, go to the translate section and type your text in. It can also translate entire web sites, which works quite well.

**Dave Danner** · 06-23-2001, 03:34 AM

There's an Italian saying that goes "the translator is a traitor" (this is a translation, so I guess I'm guilty too). One is either true to the words and translates word-for-word, losing all nuance and contet, or one attempts to capture the nuance and context, and in doing so creates something new.

That's a bit philosophical, but I guess the idea is that even the best mechanical translation programs are going to use the former method and lose the nuance. And that's just the case where a word-for-word translation is possible. The programs have a hard time with slang and idiomatic usage. For example, any (American) English speaker would instantly recognize the difference in meaning between a mother telling her child to "get down from up there" and Disco Stu saying "get down tonight". A German translation program, looking for "get down" might go with verdriessen or hinunterwuergen, neither of which correspond to the English usages above (the first idiomatic and the second slang).

Basically, a real person is better than a computer program, and a person conversant in the idiom of the military is even better. The Internet is a great resource in this regard, since, as shown by this forum, it widens the scope of people available to help.

I wouldn't hesitate to ask for assistance here, or at FeldGrau.com's more general
Wehrmacht historical discussion forum. Most of us are here because we are interested in the history and not just the artistry of Wehrmacht militaria. Getting a peek into the thoughts of a wartime German officer would be just as satisfying to many of us as helping out a fellow forum member.

Regards,
Dave

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