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**Dr. Strangelove** · 01-21-2009, 06:46 PM

Generals

Why becasue you think German Generals are never wrong? Just kidding I am eager for somebody to answer your question.

**behblc** · 01-21-2009, 06:53 PM

I think it fair to say they would have been very aware of his low rank .

**MaxxBrunn1938** · 01-21-2009, 10:36 PM

In all my 45 years I've never heard of him getting past Corporal, even with all the books I've read and shows I've watched. I've never heard any mention of him becoming a Sgt.

But I'd be interested in hearing of proof too..

Joe

**Steve Sherlock** · 01-21-2009, 11:13 PM

Well, your friend is correct in stating that Fest notes that Hitler held a sergeant's rank. Yet, Fest is somewhat confusing here. On page 80 of his biography of Hitler, (Unfortunately, I don't have the German language version, but the English translation, (New York: Harcourt Brace Jovanovich, Inc.,, 1973), Fest refers to Hitler as a Private, First Class near the end of the war. On the next page, he refers to Hitler as a sergeant, but never mentions a promotion. Fest is the only author I've seen to refer to Hitler as a sergeant. You will notice that he doesn't mention Hitler as being a corporal.
Fest, by the way, does not list a primary source for this information.

Alan Bullock in his biography refers to Hitler as corporal. (Hitler, A Study in Tyranny, [New York: Harper & Row, 1962.]) Again, no primarly source listed.

Werner Maser's Hitler: Legend, Myth & Reality (New York: Harper & Row, 1971) cites Hitler as being a Lance-Corporal in his chronology of Hitler in Appendix A, 321 ff. ) The chronology cites the dates of the promotion along with dates of various decorations awarded Hitler. He cites his source as a 1969 translation by Ralph Manheim (London, 1969) of Mein Kampf. Obviously, the step here to take would be to check out Manheim's source, as a don't believe Hitler actually stated his rank in his book. It's probably an introduction to the translation by Manheim. (Right now I'm too lazy to go through my copy of Mein Kampf in detail looking to see if Hitler named his rank. A cursory look at what he wrote about his WWI experience doesn't reveal it.

George H. Stein sheds a bit of light on this confusion, though. In his compilation of articles and excerpts about Hitler which he edited (Hitler, New Jersey: Prentice-Hall, Inc., 1968) he states that Hitler never rose above the rank of private, first class. In a footnote to that, he writes "Hitler's rank of Gefreiter, often incorrectly translated as corporal, was the equivalent of British Army lance corporal and United States Army private first class." (Stein, p. 6, n. 2.) Brian L. Davis, in his famous German Army Uniforms and Insignia 1933-1945 does state that the British Army equivalent of a Gefreiter was a lance-corporal. (p. 14).

The key here, I think, is the proper translation for the term Gefreiter. If some of our readers have the German translation of Fest's and Maser's books referred to above, perhaps they could look to see the German term used. I've never heard anything other than Gefreiter, but maybe I missed something. In any event, I think the singular reference by Fest as a sergeant is wrong, perhaps even a mistake he didn't catch, given his other references to Hitler as a private first class. It might well be a translation mistake.

Sadly, with the possible exception of Manstein's translation of Mein Kampf, which I don't have, none of these authors list an actual primary source for Hitler's WWI rank. Also, none of the authors mention any promotion to Hitler following the war. Maser lists his promotion to lance-corporal as 1. November 1914.

Hope this gives you something to work with.

I must say, though, that my "at home" library is certainly not up to date with respect to Hitler biographies. Frankly, I'm rather burned out on him for the most part, and don't keep up with the newest bios. Most of these are new "interpretations," and don't add much new factual material. Perhaps, though, someone has come out with the definitive answer as to your question in the past ten years. Let me know what you find out.

Steve

**snowdown** · 05-12-2009, 10:15 PM

Thanks for sharing this. It's important for me.
german translation

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Hitler's Army Record.

Hitler's Army Record.

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