German ski jager questions

[Gray]

I had some questions about the German ski jagers-

I have seen photos of them with climbing gear, I was wondering do they climb only in the summer when there is no snow to ski on or do they also climb when there is snow and they are skiing? If so did they carry their climbing and ski gear?

during battle did they ski with their helmets on?

also about their tactics, would a ski jager squad be used to track, check and harass the enemy troops and then return to a base with other mountain type troops or would they stay out in the mountains setting up camps and staying on their own.

were they in radio contact with other troops?

any info is helpful including book names, sites, etc. most of the info I have found tends to talk manly about the gear and not battle situations.

thanks in advance.

[BergführerKiser]

Gr******252;******223; Gott Skij******228;ger Gray,

Where have you seen photos of them with climbing gear? Perhaps they were misidentified and were really Gebirgsj******228;gers?

The 1st Skij******228;ger Brigade (later 1st Skij******228;ger Division) was formed in September 1943 and was part of Army Group Center...in the flat-lands (steps) of Mother Russia.

Not much written about them in English, but if you can read German I would recommend Georg Gunter's book "Die Deutschen Skij******228;ger: Von den Anf******228;ngen bis 1945." It has over 300 pages of the unit history and photos.

Ski Heil!!!

[Gray]

thanks BergführerKiser-

maybe on closer inspection they don't have climbing gear - i thought i saw ropes hanging out of their packs before. I think these guys are in Norway 1940. Does that mean they are Gebirgsjägers - with skis?

Thanks for the book suggestion - unfortunately i don't read German.

Oops, apparently I cannot post attachments.

[Simon O.]

Well the first thing to remember is that a German soldier on skis does not automatically mean he's a skijäger. The first German troops in WWII to be ski trained were indeed gebirgsjäger and any photo from Norway in 1940 showing German troops on skis would be of GJ.

Later on some regular German infantry were ski trained (ie. they were formally trained on proper courses rather than just handed a pair of skis and told to get on with it) for example some of the infantry stationed in Norway.

In 1942 the Germans set up the first 'ski' units. These were 'jagd' later called 'jäger' battalions (not to be confused with the jäger divisions). Those in Russia went on to be brought together to form the 1 Skijäger brigade, in Finland there were another two, the 3 and 6 Jäger battalions and they existed up until the end of the war.


Think of skijäger as light infantry but also trained and equipped to be more mobile in winter. I think the 1 Skijäger division is truely a forgotten elite, they had the misfortune of being formed when the tide had turned and the Germans were on the defensive but they nevertheless performed very well. They were also almost at the top of the list for new weapons, at least some, being issued the new Sturmgewehr and panzerschreck in the Autumn of 1943. In the book mentioned by Patrick there's an OOB for the division dated Jan 1945 and you'd be surprised just how strong and well equipped they were, about as heavily equipped as a panzergrenadier division.


They also had few interesting differences in their personal equipment. For example, it was decided that the 'panzer wrap' style of jacket was more suitable for ski troops than the regular jacket and many were issued the field grey version more commonly seen on sturmartillerie crews. They also found the the fallschirmjäger helmet was better suited to their needs than the regular helmet.

[Simon O.]

Here are a couple of shots from a grouping i have to a member of Jäger btl.3
many of the men that went to the Jäger Btls and the 1 Skijäger Brig. came from the gebirgstruppe, this guy had originally been in GJR 85.

[Simon O.]

nr.2

[Simon O.]

and of course in winter wheeled carts were replaced by sleds.


Patrick, you notice the kind of mittens the guy's wearing?

[BergführerKiser]

Servus Simon,

Gotta love those knitted Reindeer mittens!!! I was just wearing the wonderful pair that your wife knitted for me. Tell her many thanks again from me.

Skij******228;ger vor!

[Gray]

thanks guys all that helps a lot, i'm very interested.

i just found a used book at the strand (bookstore) called "Alpine Elite - German Mountian Troops of WWII". I'm not sure how much they will talk about the ski jagers, if at all, but it was only a few bucks.

so the ski jagers were a highly mobile infantry unit. it doesn't sound like the ski jagers where used like the French SES skier scouts (from what little i know about them). I think they pulled some heavier machine guns and some mortars by sleds and where armed somewhat well - but i think they where used only as scouts. do you guys know about the french ski units SES or the Italian Alpini?

great photos by the way.

[BergführerKiser]

Grüß Di' Gray,

Alpine Elite is a good book, but does not go into the Skijägers.

Gebirgsjägers, Jägers, and Skijägers were all considered as light infantry, though as Simon mentioned the 1st Skijäger Division ended up more like Panzergrenadiers.

I'm not familiar with the French SES skier scouts, but the Chasseur Alpin and the Italian Alpini were both mountain troops and were similar to their German counterparts. As to books about these troops...not much in English.
A good book that has French Chasseur Alpin, Italian Alpini, and German Gebirgsjägers is Henri Beraud's book "Bataille des Alps: Album Memorial Juin 1940 - 1944/45" which is published by Editions Heimdal. This book does have english captions. Another book with english captions is Guido Rosignoli's "Alpini: uniformi, distintivi, equipaggiamento ed armi dalla costituzione ai giorni nostri" which is about the Italian Alpini.

Another great Gebirgsjäger book is Roland Kaltenegger's "German Mountain Troops in World War II: A Photographic Chronicle of the Elite Gebirgsjägers" which is published by Schiffer Military History Books.

A Skijäger resource that I forgot to mention is the Special Series, Number 20, Dated 31 January 1944 "German Ski Training and Tactics" which was prepared by the Military Intelligence Division of the US War Department. Sometimes you can find copies of this on ebay or in used book stores.

I've been working on getting some of my Jägers from my reenactment unit out on skis when we have snow here on the eastcoast

















Ski Heil und Horrido!

[Gray]

Wow! thanks again for the wonderful info. yeah not being able to read in german or french has put a damper on researching. I am going to read the Alpine Elite book and try to find some of the other titles you mentioned. I may have some more questions for you guys or want to bring up some discussion points once I learn more.

More great photos.

Is that you in a reenactment photo? I bet you learn a lot when you out reliving it. Yeah, next to no snow in NYC so far.

In that one photo where the troops are looking at the front of a sleigh - is that a dead horse head or a passed out boar? I wonder what they are looking at?

-gray

[Simon O.]

Neither, it's a dog sled!

The jäger Btls. in Finland, and for that matter Ski Btl.82 of the 7 Geb.div. and the Norwegian SS-Skijäger Btl. of the 6 SS-Geb.Div. 'Nord' were used for long range patrolling tasks. The terrain there was very difficult, hardly populated, thick forests, swamps and lakes everywhere. Troops on both sides were thinly stretched in many areas and these jägers were especially used to patrol the large areas where there was no continuose front.

[BergführerKiser]

Servus Gray,

Simon is correct. It's a dog sled with a dog resting along with the Gebirgsj******228;gers as they pause during a patrol. The two photos above the dog sled one show the Akja pull sled which was widely used to haul MG's, Mortars, and supplies. It could be pulled by men, dogs, or Reindeer (very common in Lappland) as shown in the painting.

[Simon O.]

And the 'akja' or 'pulk' is almost unchanged in military service today (at least in the British armed forces), as well as the ski stretcher set.

[ChrisA]

Hello

Here some photos used for the research for a book by me about Ski-Btl.Schleebruegge predecessor of the Ski.Jg.Brig. and division.

"Designing" the winter camo for the battalion

The skies were built in the workshop of the unit