Badge Opinion - JMME Para badge

[Jos L C]

Here's the picture of my Juncker.
Middle left of the threeband,top of the threeband and right/top of the threeband are little haircracks.
When you go to the right of the threeband and follow the wreath you can find some more when you look hard.

Jos.

[Jos L C]

Sorry,forgot to add the pic.

[Luftm40]

Hi guys, the cracks you are talking about are from the die forging technique, and are something I look for on an original early badge, especially Juncker pieces. You can also find them on the early, unmarked flight clasps (also made by Juncker IMO). Sometimes the cracks are hard to notice, sometimes very noticeable

[Mark S.]

Andy, is this what you are refering to as a result of "cold shunting" in your article?

[ERIC S.]

Oh Yeah!

Hi Jos,
No Problem! - Sure enough when I looked at it under magnification there they were - those tell tale cracks - The cracks on mine are mostly at 10 o'clock and 12 o'clock - I've attached an enlarged scan!
ERIC

[Lorenzo Brown]

Hi Guys. Thank you for all of your responses. Yes...the badge I posted in the first thread is NOT the same as the generally acknowledged JMME Para badge such as the example posted by Eric. The badge I posted has a different wreath, different eagle with a smaller head; lacks details; different rivets; etc.

The dealer I purchased the badge from said that it was an early JMME para badge- the "early" being the apparant reason for the differences.

My question is: Do you think the badge is authentic? Or is it a fake? Is it possible that JMME made an early- or pre-war, 1st pattern para badge that differs from the generally accepted mid -war type?

As Tony said, the badge is well-made. It is not like the typical fakes you would see on Ebay or Manions.

[Tim Calvert]

It does look like somebody choked your chicken Lorenzo (on the badge!).
When your dealing with variables such as "JMME used other makers parts, its an earlier version, etc." it makes it hard to say for sure.
If you are having problems believing in the badge and its causing you to loose sleep at night, let the dealer know. IF he is honorable, he will gladly refund your $$.

[Jos L C]

Hello,
Thanks Eric for the picture,awesome that big.....can you do one this big of the reverse for my reference ??
Well,the cracks are there,a good sign,great badge too,Juncker made IMO,but without the toe clipping,something Juncker did.
It's hard to fake the cracks IMO,not with casting anyway !
Fakers do need the heavy machines for that..HaHA...

Lorenzo,I don't know if JMME made a early parabadge,I think they used the Junckerpiece.....if they had a early badge it should've been a very flat type and the quality of the eagle should've been exeptional in detail IMO,all early badges are very detailed......!!
To be honest I like the "Yuri and Eric" badges better than your badge.

Jos.

[Tim B.]

Hi guys,

Well, I would like to post my $0.02 worth here and it's probably only worth two cents compared to some of the big hitters on Luftwaffe badges here.

There was a thread earlier this year on IMME para badges and this difference in eagle was discussed there as well. At that time I also thought IMME badges had the thinner neck eagle when compared to other manufacturers, but was then reminded they had both styles.

Using what little references I have, I see the thinner necked eagle in For Fuhrer and Fatherland (2nd ed; pg. 194) and a thicker necked eagle in Detlev's catalog (pg. 516). I would also like to post the following PICS that I copied from somebody's previous post (I thought they were yours Jos) so hope I don't offend anybody here by posting them. Last Post will be one offered for sale from a European dealer that appears to me to be geniune, but what do I know.
Tim

Front:

[Tim B.]

Reverse:

[Tim B.]

Here's the cased one that is/was for sale. I also wanted to point out that Formans (3rd ed; pg 143) has another thicker necked eagle.
Tim

[ERIC S.]

For Wespennest

Here you go Jos, an enlarged shot of the reverse -

[Jos L C]

Hello Tim,
I don't think it was me posted this badge.
By seeing the one you've posted I still don't like this badge.
I've seen very,very well cast badges on shows and everything.
I like to know if there's any handfinishing done on these badges.
Even if early(which I don't believe concerning the lack of detail on the eagle ) the badge must have traces of handfinishing.
To be honest it looks like a very well cast badge to me,it just don't "feels" right to me.
Also don't like the blowtorching look at the back.
Compare early flat Juncker badges whatever what kind with this and you'll see the Junckers are very detailed and crisp.
I once had a unmarked flat early Assmann Pilotsbadge that was extremly detailed on its claws and breastfeathers etc.
Everyone that has this parabadge in his collection has to investigate it thoroughly if it is a die-forged badge....
I'm curious to hear the result !
Thanks Eric for the shot,without any doubt a great badge for me !

Jos.

[Lorenzo Brown]

Hi Jos and all. Here are some more scans. The badge is vaulted. The wreath was hand finished. I don't see signs of casting, but what do you think? Also, it looks to me like the swaz was burnished.

[Lorenzo Brown]

Wreath