Dkig

[Bruce Jarrett]

I just received this. It is a Zimmerman light but the odd thing is the back is copper instead of the usual white color metal. You can see traces of the white metal around the rivets but the rest of the back is copper color and tarnish. How usual is it that 99% of the white metal would be worn off the back or do you think this has been highly cleaned on the back and tarnish has reappeared. The side shot shows the cupal metal of copper and white metal. I have a front shot that shows that it hasn't been cleaned on the front. Thanks

[Bruce Jarrett]

front

front

[Bruce Jarrett]

Just realized I put this in the wrong section. Putting it in the Crosses section

[Tom Yanacek]

Hello Bruce,

It's a nice original.

Best regards,
Tom

[Bruce Jarrett]

I also think its an original but it seemed odd that almost all of the white metal is gone from the back. Doesn't seem like normal wear. I searched the wire and couldn't find another like it .

[Tom Yanacek]

I also think its an original but it seemed odd that almost all of the white metal is gone from the back. Doesn't seem like normal wear. I searched the wire and couldn't find another like it .

Hello Bruce,

I see a lot of minute scratches in the surface of the cupal, so it appears that someone tried to buff it up a bit and, in so doing, removed the silver finish. I still think it looks great.

Best regards,
Tom

[Bruce Jarrett]

Yes it does have a lot of scratches like from scribing but I think they may have been removing tarnish instead of the white metal because of the white metal down the center . Could the white metal on this one have been very thin and actually wore off from wear . It then became heavily tarnished and then someone tried removing some tarnish , probably with tooth paste, causing the copper co;or to come back in some areas.

[Tom Yanacek]

Yes it does have a lot of scratches like from scribing but I think they may have been removing tarnish instead of the white metal because of the white metal down the center . Could the white metal on this one have been very thin and actually wore off from wear . It then became heavily tarnished and then someone tried removing some tarnish , probably with tooth paste, causing the copper co;or to come back in some areas.

Hello Bruce,

If I'm not mistaken, cupal is copper-clad aluminum. So it is an aluminum base surrounded by a jacket of copper. Then there is a thin silver finish over the cupal. It looks to me like the thin silver finish was buffed away. And why is some silver finish remaining in the center? Because I think most of the buffing was done with the pin closed and therefore the center was somewhat protected by the pin being in the way. And the silver finish is still present around the rivets because it would take meticulous effort to scrub away that. The rivets actually protect that finish from being worn away.

Best regards,
Tom

[Bruce Jarrett]

The areas that have tanish is over copper but the tarnish being uneven makes me think the silver wash was removed sometime ago probably like you think the pin and rivets protecting those areas. Then the tarnish being removed recently casing the copper to come out. Thanks for the info about cupal. I thought cupal was copper over something but I didn't know what the base metal was.

[rlimike]

A good (20) Zimmerman.

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Bruce,

Tom's description is spot on, and would agree that the thin silver finish was buffered away for the most part revealing the copper.

The aluminum slab in the middle of Cupal is the reason why these "light" zimmermans's are so light; relative to the heavy brass (tombak) used with the "heavies".

Tom

[Ross Lee]

Looks like a good one to me too.

[Bruce Jarrett]

I have no doubt that the badge is real but I'm trying to understand the lack of frosting on the back. Hard to believe someone would be dumb enough to take a silver item and make it copper. I haven't seen one in my search of the wire or net of another one with this much frosting gone but if someone has one I would like to see it. I looked close to see if someone was trying to remove an inscription but could not find a trace of one. Is it possible from wear ? Thanks

[Tom Yanacek]

I have no doubt that the badge is real but I'm trying to understand the lack of frosting on the back. Hard to believe someone would be dumb enough to take a silver item and make it copper. I haven't seen one in my search of the wire or net of another one with this much frosting gone but if someone has one I would like to see it. I looked close to see if someone was trying to remove an inscription but could not find a trace of one. Is it possible from wear ? Thanks

Hi Bruce,

It looks to me like just an overzealous cleaning attempt. That frosted silver finish over the cupal is only a few microns thick and it can be stripped away in no time, whether by liquid silver dip or a silver paste polish. It really does not take much effort to do that. I used to own a lightweight Zimmermann DKiG that showed mostly copper on the backside, but I sold it years ago. I had pictures of it posted on this forum and I even located the thread were it was posted. Unfortunately, the pictures have mysteriously vanished from the thread.

Best regards,
Tom

[Bruce Jarrett]

Thanks That information helps on how easy it is to remove the silver finish.