Early maker mark variations, Assmann?

[Peter B]

Observer

I have an early Assmann observer with a raised makers mark.

Sorry that the attached pics. do not show a clear shot of the mark however I will endeavour to get one.

[Peter B]

2

[Peter B]

Price...

I'm considering placing this one on the estand.

Can anyone suggest a reasonable market price?

Any info. would be appreciated.

[Robert P.]

Peter,
Thanks for the addition to the thread. Very nice badge. Assmann observers are great pieces. Yes, I would like to see the raised maker mark on this badge.
As for the market value of this badge, it would depend upon the dealer. I purchased an early Assmann observer perhaps six months ago from a dealer for $650.00. It was in nice but worn condition as yours. Very little frosting in the recesses of the wreath. The pin was still very straight. Two weeks ago I purchased another badge of the same make that was in very nice 'text-book' condition for $645.00. It has nearly all of the frosting to the wreath and the eagle and swastica look in near mint cond. This same dealer had other Assmann observers for as little as $575.00 that were in the same condition as the piece you posted. Like I say, it depends upon which dealer you buy through.
I hope this has helped a little.


Robert

[Peter B]

Hi Robert
Thanks for the info. It is appreciated.

I'll attempt to locate a pic of the maker mark.

[François SAEZ]

I believe that it would be better for early Assmann not to mix para badges with pilot nor observer badges

My opinion concerning early Assmann pilot badges, like many, they were unmarked and with a large space between the legs - Also true for PO - I believe Frank has one.

I also believe that for a certain time, they were mostly marked on the wreath only - but that could be because only the wreath was made by Assmann (I don't believe so).

[IVAN]

hi Francois,

what do you think about early type have not cut-out space between wings? As I have said I don't believe it, early ones has cut out space by my opinion.

Ivan

[François SAEZ]

Ivan,
I share your opinion even if para are NOT my field

[Robert P.]

Earliest para?

Dear members,
Concerning the issue of which was the earliest para pattern, does anyone have a photo of a zinc Assmann para badge? I think seeing one of these would help in solving this issue once and for all.
I'm going to stick my neck out here by adding this: Wouldn't it make more sense that the cut-out version was the first pattern Assmann para? There was a lot more detailing work to do to this cut-out version of this badge. As the war progressed and there became more of a demand on the Assmann company to produce more and also different types of badges, there would be less time to detail (finish) each individual piece like before. And the stamping process as a seperate operation would have been eliminated by incorporating the raised maker mark to the badges. Make sense to anyone else, or do I stand alone with this idea? A photo of a mid or late-war zinc para with this cut-out wing feature would solve this for us all, or at least for me. Perhaps I am the only one who needs to see this proven.
It will prove interesting.

Robert

[Mark S.]

I think the non cutouts are the same as the ones that have a cut out wing. How can we decide to what degree of handfinishing was intended to be done? I have seen pilot badges with intricate wings as well as so-so wings. Again on pilot badge-between the legs cut outs...some had it , some didnt.

I dont see enough differences between mine and ones like it with cut out wings to warrant any type of classification regarding when it was made based on the wing cut outs. Any questions I might have had were answered by the badge posted by Philippe. Obviously not an early badge..but without cutouts. Proof to me that there is no ryhme or reason in this area.

The postcard is nice, but notice also even though it is cut out, it is even more so than regular badges. Every bump and lump appears to be cut.

Assmann Co. does some weird stuff..they wack off the toes on pilot badges, the observers look like cartoon birds, and these goose neck eagles on the para badges. Assmann would be the last company I would pigeonhole for any type of regularity, short of material supply.

[Robert P.]

Thank you, Mark. I had totally forgotten about Phillipes photo of his zinc mid-war para badge back on page two. Well, there is the truth. The earlier badges do not have the cut-out. This is closer to an absolute than anything else up to this point. I stand corrected. Sometimes logic is not the answer. I'm going to keep an eye open in the future for more leads on this particular para badge and it's variations. It's been a good thread.

Robert

[IVAN]

Originally posted by robert pierce
Thank you, Mark. I had totally forgotten about Phillipes photo of his zinc mid-war para badge back on page two. Well, there is the truth. The earlier badges do not have the cut-out. This is closer to an absolute than anything else up to this point. I stand corrected. Sometimes logic is not the answer. I'm going to keep an eye open in the future for more leads on this particular para badge and it's variations. It's been a good thread.

Robert

Hi Robert,

I am confused but...... in Philippe photo is showing a late zinc type without cut-out.

Ivan

[Mark S.]

early-no cut outs - mid war-no cut outs

early with cut out out- mid to late with cut outs.

No set rules. I guess it depends how ambitious they were they day.

[Robert P.]

Somehow I got Phillipes zinc para badge confused with another badge. I thought it had the cut-out area to the wings. I was wrong. I went back to see that it definately does not have the cut-out. Sorry for the confusion.
My main concern when I started this thread was to uncover as many variations to the Assmann's maker mark stamp as possible. I think we've accomplished this. Thank you for your help. It shifted a little when we introduced the different variations of para badges. And that was good too.
Regarding the cut-out versus the non cut-out, I would lean more toward the stamping technique of the maker mark as a clue to when the badges were produced chronologically. But when I look at all of the examples posted here there is no set pattern here either. It looks like Phillipes example is hand-stamped. Others that are of earlier production (buntmetal rather than zinc) have the raised maker mark which you would think was a later- period technique. And still my early buntmetal badges have the stamped-in maker mark too. I think you're right, Mark, Assmann was a little 'different'.
Robert