High Seas Fleet Badge

[John R.]

reverse

[EMSMIT2]

Thanks for the info. Here are some more pictures of my badge. I am still having some trouble determining if this is fake. I noticed the triangular protrusions from the wreath and the concave reverse looks very similar to the ones that are mentioned as good. The flat wire catch and dome hinge look good to me too. I am at a bit of a loss. I know my pictures are not the best and the condition may be an issue too.

Thanks,
Eddie

[EMSMIT2]

reverse

[EMSMIT2]

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[EMSMIT2]

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[EMSMIT2]

I cannot seem to get any decent pictures. Tomorrow, when it is daylight, I will go outside and take some better pics.

Eddie

[EMSMIT2]

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[EMSMIT2]

1-4

[EMSMIT2]

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[EMSMIT2]

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[Jeff V]

Thanks for the new images. I have to admit it looks better after looking at these new pictures, however the incredibly poor condition of the badge is making it difficult for me to say for sure. Things I saw that I did not like in the first images don't look so bad now. Was this a ground dug piece? I can't recall seeing a HSF in this rough condition before.
best wishes,
jeff

[EMSMIT2]

Thanks for the new images. I have to admit it looks better after looking at these new pictures, however the incredibly poor condition of the badge is making it difficult for me to say for sure. Things I saw that I did not like in the first images don't look so bad now. Was this a ground dug piece? I can't recall seeing a HSF in this rough condition before.
best wishes,
jeff

Not quite sure to be honest. Someone told me it looks like it may have had some blood on it at one time. I know blood makes a bit of a curdling look on metal. I am going to try my best to get some quality pictures of the badge tomorrow.

Thanks,
Eddie

[John R.]

OK, thanks for the new images. I will PM Mike Kenny and get his read on this and also send images to Gordon Williamson for an opinion. The images you have provided are good enough.

John

[Mike Kenny]

Hi,

My internet connection has been down for a day, so I'm only now getting to see this thread after reading John's PM.

The extra pics were very useful indeed - they showed some of the subtle reverse characteristics I look for in originals that were not apparent on the original pics.

Imo an original tombak example but in poor, corroded and probably ground dug condition.

Regards
Mike

[John R.]

Gordon Williamson (prolific author of books on the Kriegsmarine) has agreed with Mike based on the new photos. Tombak example. No dobut in his mind.

Of note, in the first series of images and my side by side comparison, what I thought were pits are in reality flakes.

So with Mike Kenny, an expert in this series of badges by Schwerin (and I wish his study was available but seems to be lost in a computer glitch in this forum) and Gordon Williamson both independently agreeing on this example as period, it is without doubt period.

The new photos were most helpful and the old photos are what fooled both Jeff and I initially.

Good work JustinG and EMSMIT2 for spotting this one as original right from the start. Remember, it is not zinc though, it is tombak as EMSMIT2 thought.

The other issue is the condition of this badge; I must say I have never seen a badge quite in this condition but it remains period no matter. I am glad in the end it is period for the owner and appreciate the post.

John