Unmarked Schwerin U-boat?

[John R.]

Has anyone else seen an unmarked Schwerin U-boat badge with the wire catch before?

John

[John R.]

Reverse

[Martin W]

John,my unmarked Schwerin has the flat,rectangular catch.
Martin.

[John R.]

Yes, that is my point. Only the last version of this badge, the one with the flat catch, was unmarked to my knowledge.

This badge though looks good, but it is unmarked with a wire catch.

So the question is, assuming it is a good badge, was this badge produced in this version without a maker's mark.

John

[Ron P]

Would it be possible to post a closeup of the catch?

[John R.]

I will say that the following bothers me on this badge:

1. The horizontal lines on the hinge are missing, the part of the hinge block at the very bottom of the hinge.

2. The pin is wrong.

All that said, the front is pretty good. I would take a pass on this badge myself, but I am still not sure what the story is on it. If a fake, they have the front down almost perfectly.

The only other choice is that it is not a Schwerin badge, but an unknown maker, but I am not aware of another badge that quite looks like this one.

John

[John R.]

Would it be possible to post a closeup of the catch?

No, I just copied it from a website. John

[rhudspith]

Hi John,

First one I've seen, I think this may be OK but would need it in hand. Any chance of some better pics from the dealer? Colour looks a little funny but probably the photo

The style of the eagle is consistant with that found on those with a round wire catch and the thickness of the eagles neck would suggest quite an early piece. the pin does look a little funny but have found two styles on these as photos show.

One has what can be described as a fish tail at the attachment to the hinge and a bit fatter at the bottom

[rhudspith]

Another style

[John R.]

My take is that it is a real Schwerin. Now, maybe for the first time, we seem to have evidence that both the wire catch and the flat catch were produced with unmarked versions.

John

[John R.]

Also note the deep and faint strike of the maker's mark in these wire catch versions. Both good of course. Also a difference in the font.
John

[rhudspith]

Also note the deep and faint strike of the maker's mark in these wire catch versions. Both good of course. Also a difference in the font I think. Atleast I think it is a different font, maybe not, the difference just being the depth of the strike.

Wonder if the one with light strike just wore out and they produced ones without a strike at all explaining the badge at the top of the thread.

John

Not sure if these are different font or just caused by the depth in strike, I need to get a good close up of both to compare but not have been able as yet. Having said that the C in Schwerin does look a bit more rounded on the light strike.

[John R.]

My take at this point is that the strike became fainter for some reason. So the earliest badge was the deep strike wire catch, got fainter and fainter. Maybe it just went away before they decided to redo to the design and go to the flat catch, marked. John

[Jeff V]

My take at this point is that the strike became fainter for some reason. So the earliest badge was the deep strike wire catch, got fainter and fainter. Maybe it just went away before they decided to redo to the design and go to the flat catch, marked. John

I would disagree. The first stamp and second stamp are different IMO. The line-up of the letters from top line to bottom line is slightly different as well as the shape of the letters. I am still not sure of the originality of the badge that started this thread. I would need a lot better pictures to be sure it was good. best wishes,
jeff

[Mike Kenny]

Hi,

Interesting discussion I missed!

I've had an early unmarked Schwerin roundwire catch example in my collection for years. I say early because I believe the earliest Schwerin U-boat badges were only produced with the roundwire catch and that the flatwire catches were used later for better contact area - as is seen on ALL other types of Schwerin tombak badges (which of course were instituted quite a bit later than the U-boat badge). I don't have any pics of my example with me (I may have sent them to Rob H ages ago??) but my example has the same main pin as in Rob's Post#9.

The depth of MM strike should imo not be an indicator of an early v's late badge. These marks would have been hand applied (not part of the die), therefore position and depth will vary from one strike to the next.

I haven't studied Schwerin U-boats in detail, but for what it's worth I always thought there were two MM variations - one slightly smaller than the other?

Regards
Mike