how many different IAB makers?

[Master3477]

Hello

I had this pictures in a different thread already. I guess it`s better to open a new thread for it.

On the picture you see 5 IABs. The left one is a unmarked OM. But how many different makers do you see? Are all different or which ones belong to the same maker?

[Master3477]

reverses:

[Frank Heukemes]

Hard to say for sure, Sven. While 1 is CLEARLY different from the rest, 2,3,4 and 5 are so close that it might just be a question of different or reworked dies with a setup evolution/variations from ONE maker. Maybe of course more makers because of the differing reverse cutouts, but very hard to be sure.

[Philippe DB]

Hi Sven,


IMO number 1 is different from the rest. 2,3,4 an5 are all by one and the same maker that most likely used different dies.

But like Frank wrote, impossible to tell for sure. There is also the possibility of one designer providing dies to different makers but in that case and also taken in to account that this isn't a scares design I would expect that at least one of those makers marked their product.

KR
Philippe

[greg.hays]

Well the one designer with multiple dies seems like an interesting theory. I would love to see one of these badges turn up with a makers mark it would really shed some light on this situation. Unfortunately, I can't see the comparison pics Sven posted something wrong with my browser maybe.

[Philippe DB]

Well the one designer with multiple dies seems like an interesting theory.

Hi Greg,

This isn't just a theory it was done this way, however I'm not sure that this is what we are looking at here. Just not enough variation when it comes to set-ups.

For me the best example of one designer providing different companies with a die is still the "Wernstein design PAB", used by Wernsten, RRS, RS, Fo, AWS, EWE, the flatback PAB maker, the dished PAB maker and a few other unknown makers.

KR
Philippe

[Bruce Simcox]

Hi guys......

......I too see 5 seperate badges. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough in my statement in the previous thread. What I meant to say was this:

Out of these five badges exhibited only three badges, in my opinion, look as if they popped from the same mold. Namely 2, 3 and 4. The remainding two badges 1 and 5 being unique(although 5 is very close to 2, 3 and 4 and it could perhaps be the result of a slight redesigning using new dies). So......I'm going to stick my neck out and say that there are three different manufacturers involved here.

Very nicely done photo montage Sven. My compliments.

-------------------------

Bruce

[greg.hays]

Hi all, I can now see the comparison pic and it is a very nice job Sven! I have to agree with Bruce and stick with my original opinion that there are 3 different makers here.

[Ian Lim]

Hi Guys,

Pic 5 looks like an L/10 to me, but I am not sure because the pictures are not clear.

[Philippe DB]

Hi Ian,

Very good observation. Don't know where the pic comes from but it is an L/10. Also notice that the contours of the K98 aren't visible in the cutout of that badge. So it doesn't really belong in this comparison.

If you compare the L/10 to 2,3 & 4, there are indeed a lot of similarities to be found but also sufficient difference to conclude that they never could have come out of the same die.

KR
Philippe

[Ian Lim]

Hi Philippe,

Thanks for the confirmation.

I spotted the L/10 because of the sagging neck of the eagle and the higly detailed feet.

Is pic 4 the "Porsche IAB" you told me about in another post last time?

I have a similar piece in my collection.

[Philippe DB]

Hi Philippe,


Is pic 4 the "Porsche IAB" you told me about in another post last time?

I have a similar piece in my collection.

Hi Ian,

I don't think so , to many differences in the wreath design. However I often wondered where the zinc massive or hollow counterparts of the nickel silver"Porsche" IAB are. We know this maker produced both the PAB and the GAB in zinc but somehow I can't find the zinc IAB. I guess its always possible that the design was changed in such away that we aren't able to recognize it anymore.

KR
Philippe

[Ian Lim]

Hi Philippe,

Thanks, point noted.

[Master3477]

Hello,

any more opinions?