Information For A Bad PAB Please.

[Michael Kasper]

From what I have seen and understand, this PAB is a fake or reproduction. Unfortunately, I am relatively new to collecting these badges specifically and was not aware before I purchased 2 of these that so much information is available now on the web. Let's say I was not in a position to find the original seller and really got burned! These badges on the surface really looked pretty darn good to me with detail and patina. I have since seen good repros. and even bad original ones. It can be hard to tell sometimes. Can someone please tell me if it is known who made these fake badges? Are they documented somewhere as being reproductions? I appreciate any history on these. Thanks.

[Michael Kasper]

"Maker's Mark"

[Michael Kasper]

clasp hinge

[Greg]

Hi Michael,

I don't know that anyone has documentation that this type is fake - in other words, I don't know that we can prove which modern individuals or companies are making them - but the proof is in the design differences. The design on both front and back is very different from known original PABs by "AS in triangle" (probably the Adolf Scholze company). There are a couple of different variations of known originals, but all are semi-hollow (scooped backs), all have the mark on the back of the swastika, and all have a ball hinge. Here's one example.

Regards,
Greg

[Greg]

And here's another fake that is in some ways more convincing than the one you showed, since it seems to be cast from an actual Scholze PAB so the design elements are better. The giveaways are the cast-in block hinge and incorrect thin roundwire catch.

Note that the flatback kind you showed is even more commonly seen with the HA mark for Hermann Aurich and with a ball hinge, but the wrong type of hinge for Aurich badges. These flatback fakes have been around for at least 10 years, if not longer.

Greg

[Michael Kasper]

Hi Michael,

I don't know that anyone has documentation that this type is fake - in other words, I don't know that we can prove which modern individuals or companies are making them - but the proof is in the design differences. The design on both front and back is very different from known original PABs by "AS in triangle" (probably the Adolf Scholze company). There are a couple of different variations of known originals, but all are semi-hollow (scooped backs), all have the mark on the back of the swastika, and all have a ball hinge. Here's one example.

Regards,
Greg

Greg, many thanks for taking the time to reply and provide good information and examples!

[Scott Asperheim]

Michael,

Here's a great site on PAB's (by W-A member Mike Pinkus).

http://tankbadges.homestead.com/

kr,
Scott

[Bob Hunter*]

I'll second that! Mike, has become a friend and mentor for me on the PAB.

[Michael Kasper]

I'll second that! Mike, has become a friend and mentor for me on the PAB.

Many thanks for the great information! If anyone is interested in the 2 fake PAB's I mentioned in this thread for good examples of what not to buy, please email me.

[Mike Kenny]

I don't know that anyone has documentation that this type is fake - in other words, I don't know that we can prove which modern individuals or companies are making them

Hi,

I don't have access to my references but I think these might actually have been written up in the early-mid 90s in the now defunct English version of Militaria Magazine. No indication as to the who, where, when.

I was taken by one of these in the late 80's when they first hit DownUnder - it looked great and came with a - literally! - sugar frosting! In hindsite the b*stard dealer knew it as well - and someone was discussing R Bellars (sp)recently?

Regards
Mike K