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    #1

    Questions on an Anti Partisan Badge

    Dear all,

    I know these are not pics of a desirable quality, but for now they are all that can be provided. It is a bronze badge.

    I would like to draw your attention to the catch. This type of APB, with this pin and hinge and two cut outs, usually has a catch of flat wire material. Is this round type wire also usual? Does anybody have a badge exactly like this one with that catch?

    I am confident the badge is ok, just want to get opinions on the catch. Of course, I would also like to hear your comments if YOU think this one is bad. The cleave you see on the obverse at the very top next to the top sword grip is a minor die imperfection.

    P.S.: for all jokers, these are NOT images made with my new scanner

    Cheers, Frank H.
    Cheers, Frank

    Tags: None
    #2
    reverse
    Cheers, Frank

    Comment

      #3
      Ben,

      2x cut out and this type pin/hinge are ok, no need to doubt them. Since I just have pics of this type in my reference pic library that have flatwire pins, I wondered about the round wire catch and wanted to see if somebody has a badge or photo just like this one.

      Cheers, Frank H.
      Cheers, Frank

      Comment

        #4
        Ben,

        I am sorry but the fake you show has NOTHING in common with the badge I show.

        Your example--> 3 cut outs
        my example ---> 2 cut outs

        Your example ---> broad barrel type hinge
        my example ---> narrow type barrel hinge

        Your example ---> flatwire catch
        my example --> roundwire catch

        Please, can I get an educated opinion from somebody who knows these badges on the pics I posted (even though they are bad quality) and my related catch question?

        P.S.: I like your new motto much better than the old one.

        Cheers, Frank H.
        Cheers, Frank

        Comment

          #5
          Frank,

          The basic body of the badge looks fine. All of the original pieces I have had through my hands in the semi hollow die cast style by AGMuK have had two cut outs, solid die struck pieces (the Juncker type) three cut outs. The original press photo from 1944 when the badge was instituted shows two cut outs.
          Here are the reverses














          All originals I have handled with the broad pin have had the narrow barrel, though I have seen needle pin types with both narrow and broad barrels.
          So far however, I have never seen one with a round wire retaining catch, only flat.
          Last edited by Gordon Williamson; 08-15-2002, 08:41 AM.

          Comment

            #6
            Thanks Gordon, much appreciated.

            Cheers, Frank H.
            Cheers, Frank

            Comment

              #7
              Gordon...AGMuK? I thought these were only made by Juncker?



              I am confused.

              Accidentally offending people on the internet since 1997

              Comment

                #8
                Nope! Juncker only made the solid die struck version.

                AGMuK were identified as the maker of the semi-hollow die cast versions some years ago in a German publication which showed all the original Verordnungsblätter from the various branches of service and illustrations of most of the variants. Trying to track down my copy to confirm, but it was definitely AGMuK. I remember because the fact that this was a co-operative rather than a single firm to my mind partially explained the differeing pin/hinge arrangements/number of piercings etc, if more than one firm in the combine was involved.

                Like I say, this isn't "fresh" news, it was published a good number of years ago.

                Gordon

                Comment

                  #9
                  Gordon

                  Thanks for the info on AGMuK I have often wondered who th e manufacturer was for these type awards.

                  With regards the semi hollow backs all the good ones I have seen have had two cut outs. What about the semi hollow backs with three cut outs ?

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Thanks for the answer to my question, Gordon. That explains the variances.

                    Learn something new here everyday..

                    Accidentally offending people on the internet since 1997

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Aha!

                      I have actually found a pic of an example very similar to my pictured one with a round wire catch. It is in Detlev´s price guide, page 483, bottom picture. The barrel is slightly longer, but pin and catch are identical.

                      Cheers, Frank H.
                      Cheers, Frank

                      Comment

                        #12
                        Lumsden's Anti Partisan Badge- Junker

                        Gordon, you refer to Junker only making a hollow back stamped APB, I take that to mean forged. Lumsden purports to show a complete (barrel hinge, needle and catch) Junker on page 141 of his book The Waffen SS. Is the pic on page 141 what you mean by hollow back stamped. Thanks, Sonny

                        Comment

                          #13
                          Ben,
                          The badge you show on this thread as an example of a fake is the same one you are selling on Ebay. There, however, you do not describe it as a fake/repro. Why?
                          OMSA #6582

                          At my age, "getting lucky" is finding my car in the parking lot.

                          Comment

                            #14
                            Sonny,

                            No, Juncker made a die stamped zinc badge, solid, with flat back. The semi-hollow backed type is actually a casting, the molten zinc being forced into the die under pressure, a system still used today for many industrial components. The blank is then placed in a finishing die and any excess flashing around the edges cropped off, this leaves die shearing marks around the edges and often gives the erroneous impression that these badges are stamped rather than cast.

                            The example in Robin Lumsdens book whilst probably genuine, is most certainly not a "typical" Juncker type piece as captioned, but the die cast AGMuK type.

                            Gordon

                            Comment

                              #15
                              APB

                              Gordon, as always thank you for your input. Sonny

                              Comment

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