Gablonz CCC in bronze real or fake

[Yuri D.]

Guys, can you please give me your opinions about this badge:

<img src=http://www.bender-publishing.com/display/ccc_muk_1.jpg>
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<img src=http://www.bender-publishing.com/display/ccc_muk_2.jpg>

[spectre]

It looks good to me but then see one of my dogs below. The tappered flat wire catch would seem to take a lot more effort to make than most forgers would go for. I see the L is missing its bottom in Gablonz. I saw it was brought up in the last thread but never answered.

Here are a couple of Gablonz marked clasps I have. Yes, the gold one is bad, recently nailed to the coffin by Detlev's copy o' the week. The silver one has one similarity to the gold and that is it has the raised line around the base of the catch and hinge. It is not very clear in my pictures but if you have a copy of Detlev's image they are very noticeable.

On the silver one, the catch is a heavier round wire like ? mark and soldered directly to the back and the 4 crimps for the back plate are raised not pressed flat like many good and bad ones. The markings are more raised and prominent than on the gold one. The back plate and pin are magnetic and the specs are weight: 39.6g, length: 98mm, height: 26mm and 4mm thick down to 2mm on the far ends. Thoughts, opinions??

Alan

[Yuri D.]

C'mon guys. I know there are more people in the know about these badges here. Please give me your opinions about this badge.

Yuri

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Yuri,
I like the detail on the front of this one, typical of a "Gablonz". What I don't like is that the "L" is lower case. I have never seen this before until a few weeks ago. Since then, I've seen about 5 of them. Seems like a lot to me, that just popped up. I don't think that is enough to discount this one, but it looks pretty damn good to me.

Tom

[Lorenzo Brown]

It looks to me like the lower leg of the "L" just didn't cast completely, making it look like lower case. Also notice that some of the periods behaind the letters didn't form well either. I think this happens when you don't clean the reverse dies well between castings. Excess material gets left in the die and the letters don't form completely.

[Tony Barto]

Guys;

I'm of the same opinion as Lorenzo that it is actually a capital L and perhaps the die was dirty. I also believe the badge to be genuine. It would be nice to see some additional comments.

Tom, could you provide us with some pix of these other badges that you've encountered like this one? They would be nice to have to make comparisons against.

[rkoy]

hello all

what was the deal about the line around the base of the pin and catch? i missed it on detlevs update! are they bad? also the 4 crimps are flat or rounded? help ive got 2 that look alot like that gold i thought they were real? rodney

[Thomas Durante]

Tony, unfortunately I don't have any pics of these, just seen them around lately. The one you emailed me was one of them, though. You sent those to me at work and I don't have them here at home, but I remember you saying it was from Yuri, so I'm guessing this is the same one.
I agree that it is a good possibility that the die may not have been cleaned properly before they struck this one as Lorenzo said. The detailing is great, color looks good, and the catch, hinge, pin and crimping all look alright. The only issue I can see is the "L".

Tom

[Yuri D.]

I would like to see these pictures. It seems that every badge group is a separate area that a person can attempt to become an expert in.

Yuri

[Tony Barto]

Come on guys;

Isn't there anyone out there familiar with this type of award? Gordon Williamson? What is your opinion? All opinions are welcome!

[spectre]

Here is Detlev's ccc picture, its big. The lines I were talking about show up as a thin ring around the catch with a small spur at 10 o'clock and around the hinge with a dogleg on the top left and another short spur going down from the top right. My gold one is identical to the copy. My silver one has a different catch and crimps for the backplate but does have these lines.

Alan