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**I Marotto** · 03-15-2004, 01:44 PM

Originally posted by Greg Walden

Hi Ian,
Did you see two more "daisies" like this one?
Thanks,
Greg

Greg
Unfortunately at the time I didnt didnt take pics. I saw the badges last August at two day show (coming again in May so I will look again then) and dont recall any specific details other than I was suspicious because the had identical wear patterns and imperfections and the finishes were weird they had that aged but new look commonly seen on repros plus the were side by side in the dealers case so I the alarms really went off. I cant remember but I thought I had posted a thread or responded to a thread regarding that I had seen them then.
Ian

**Philippe DB** · 03-15-2004, 01:45 PM

Hi Guys,

As far as I'm concerned this is a very recent fake, made by somebody who really knows PAB's.

Typical on daisies are the "scorch" markes arround hinge and catch. Visible as a darker discoloration. These guys even managed to get that right.

I'm still keeping a couple of short commings of this badge to myself just to make sure we don't give them all the info to make their next attempt even better.

KR
Philippe

**Bruce Simcox** · 03-15-2004, 01:48 PM

Hi Greg......

......glad to see that you followed your instincts and went 'the distance' in following up, with a second 'in-hand' opinion, to determine what has turned out to be a fake.

Again, we are reminded, by this demonstration, that images alone are not really enough to make a correct evaluation to decide on the authenticity of a badge. Something, I fear, that has become a liitle too commonplace for comfort. Granted, images are sometimes the only barometer available to guage by......but that in itself should never be considered as a final determining factor for authenticity's sake.

No finger pointing intended here, Just a reminder.

Your vigilance paid off and that is what counts when we arrive at the bottom line. Good show.

-------------------------

Bruce

**Hasse.M** · 03-15-2004, 02:32 PM

Many thanks to you guys!

Im deeply impressed. It's very nice to see the fight against the "fakers" goes on.
Please keep up the good work

Best regards!

**StevenD** · 03-15-2004, 08:08 PM

Very good work guys! This piece seems to be a new fake where, as mentioned, the details are getting better (I mean the correct pin and hinge and catch assembly)..fortunately they seem to be cast from real pieces but the size is too small...I have seen U-boat spanges which were obviously cast from originals and very well done, ie correct pin assembly etc...but the size was too small...if the fakers can get the size correct there will be some problems..and what do you do when if at a show you see one of these suspect pieces but are not sure? You bring a measuring device for the dimensions and weight.

**Dave Kane** · 03-15-2004, 09:43 PM

Very good work!!

Dave

**Tony Barto** · 03-16-2004, 01:29 PM

To play devils advocate here, essentially what's being said is that there are at least 4 variations of fake Daisy badges? Let me ask you, just how many original makers were there of this type of badge? Does anyone know? Also, there ARE manufacturer variations of these and other types of badges. Junckers comes to mind with their 3 "variations" of Pilots badges and Assman's "variations" of Observer badges just to name two. Before we condemn all 4 variations, are we sure that variations of this badge don't exist? Generally when new fakes come out you usually see them on your friendly militaria auction house website (just like the Schinkel EKII's previously) and I have yet to see these crop up as of yet. Am I saying they're not fake? No. All I'm saying is that until there is more proof ie; showing up on auction sites known for repops and reenactor sites I think we should slow down and take a closer look.

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