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**Mike Kenny** · 02-12-2004, 12:01 AM

Hi Joe,

Only my thoughts, but firstly 8k seems like an outrageous amount for one of these, regardless of condition. I'm am sure they were rarely AWARDED, just like the 75 GABs, but I'm not sure they are all that uncommon. Many were probably factory or over-run headquarters/supply point acquisitions (ie produced but not awarded). I'd suggest 75/100 Bronze PABs would be rarer than 100 GABs. I'm not going to consider Hindustani Balloon Badges

or other late war insitiuted badges when it comes to rarity! I'll state again, these are my opinions only.

Regards
Mike K

**Jim Folk** · 02-12-2004, 01:33 AM

Joseph,

I passed one of these up in the mid-1980s that was offered at $800 by a knowledgable dealer who began collecting during the war. A beautiful, mint example, no less, but I didn't have the cash. That said, I think the $8K price was outlandish, but I suppose it's what the market will bear... The seller needed only to find only one buyer.

I'm sure Mike is right about a large proportion of the '100' badges never being awarded. If I recall correctly, General von Manteuffel was awarded only a '25' PAB, though he very likely qualified for a higher award.

Good wishes,
Jim F

**Joseph D'Errico** · 02-12-2004, 01:52 AM

Thank you Gentlemen,

I also felt that the price point was a bit much. But with that said, any thoughts on what one should be priced at using the pretense that that badge is original and in above average condition.

Must admit I was a little taken back that the piece was sold to another in less than 24 hours of it being offered to me. I think another important point to consider is the source, in buying such rarities I think that thier is only a few dealers that I would uy such a piece from.

@ Mike,Agreed on the "100" marked PABs, even so I think the price point on these is less than 8K, agreed ?

Unfortunaly those that have the exspendable income to buy such pieces at those price piont does help raise the bar as dealers will sell at those types of price points as long as their are folks out thier willing to pay.

I look foward to some more input on this.

Best,
JD

**skip** · 02-12-2004, 04:14 AM

8000$, is way over the top in my opinion

Of course if you are a rich bugger who has just about every other Award and a couple of KCs to boot, its probably just peanuts

Skip

**Frank Heukemes** · 02-12-2004, 12:56 PM

Dear Joe,

For the badge you describe I would pay 3200.- EUR tops.

**Rich G** · 02-12-2004, 02:00 PM

Joe

There are 'collectors' who have more money than sense. That buyer was one of them.

Rich

**Joseph D'Errico** · 02-12-2004, 02:08 PM

Thank you,

For the input,

@ Frank, question, because you live in Germany would that make it less exspensive

Also are in a gerneral sense, which may be more coomon sense, do badges of any sorts typically cost less in Germany than the states, excluding dealers?

@ Richard, Agreed . The ones with more money than sense seem to hurt us all.

Best,
JD

**stogieman** · 02-12-2004, 04:24 PM

Well....

.... Helmut Weitze had a JFS GAB-100. Sweetest condition you ever saw. Asking price was 6500- Euro. Complete with an old Hartnung Expertise. The condition was simply superb... and it was real.

**Joseph D'Errico** · 02-12-2004, 04:34 PM

Hi Rick,

Thank you for the information, so at 6500 Euros that is not really off the mark against the 8K that I posted which is $8300.00 US round numbers . But Frank is at $4200.00 US round numbers. Hmmmmmmmm......quite a difference.

@ Frank, you said that this is what you would pay, meaning YOU, or have you seen them for that price as being the norm

@ Rick V., did you ever get your "100" GAB yet ?

Best,
JD

**tom hansen** · 02-12-2004, 05:22 PM

Originally posted by Joseph D'Errico

Hi Rick,

Thank you for the information, so at 6500 Euros that is not really off the mark against the 8K that I posted which is $8300.00 US round numbers . But Frank is at $4200.00 US round numbers. Hmmmmmmmm......quite a difference.

@ Frank, you said that this is what you would pay, meaning YOU, or have you seen them for that price as being the norm

@ Rick V., did you ever get your "100" GAB yet ?

Best,
JD

Joe-
On the collectortocollectormiliaria.com site there is a 100 GAB for $4000.

**Frank Heukemes** · 02-12-2004, 05:40 PM

It is just what I am prepared to pay for a badge like that and I think it is too much already. And it works, I bought 75 and 100 bronze PABs from collectors for less. The Detlev price for any 75 or 100 badge is still acceptable, Weitze is already much too much, and certain US dealers are simply insane. Or wait...they are not insane, the insane one is the guy who buys them from those guys at that price. 8000 USD is a joke.

**stogieman** · 02-12-2004, 07:41 PM

Interesting discussion!

Hi Joe, no, I have not found one yet. I thought I could swing a trade with Helmut, whereby I would not have paid as much as he was asking, but in the end I just could not bring myself to pay that price.
Robert Iqbal (CollectortoCollector) has a very nice one. Original, 4K is his price. Interesting from the point that the finish has come off the eagle, as opposed to what you normally see, which is the loss of gilt to the wreath. I could have bought it, but ended up passing. Robert is a member of the forum here and a good guy to deal with.
I don't know about the prices on these. I had a rough one on the eStand for $1750, tried to pass on a deal. No takers. The badge will sell in Germany for around 2000-Euro, or more....
Detlev has sold a couple of PAB's in the last few weeks with no finishh on the wreaths for 2800 or so...
While I am quite sure that these are rarer than RK's, perhaps because of the heavy fakery, perhaps because the opportunity just does not come up, but the prices have been 4K, or less... mostly, from what I have found in the US.
European dealers have some very nice badges on their sites for HUGE dollars and they sit there forever. I've seen rough PAB's/GAB's with numberes at 1000+ Euro and they are going nowhere.
Pristine examples are exceedingly difficult to find. I was lucky enough to buy 2 near mint -75's, both just over 3K, and was quite thrilled to pay that price, for that quality. But that's me. One of the fellows I bought from would have sold it at the same price in a heartbeat, while the other (probably) would have carried it a long time. But now we are talking simply dealer reputation and experience. If you do a search back through this forum, you'll find pictures of my 3 GAB-75's. Two of them are going to make way for 2 PAB's I don't have, provided I like them when they arrive in a couple of days.
Pricing is hard to pin down right now. The "old-hat" collectors think these prices are insane, but the newer guys don't seem to have any problems paying the price, for the quality, provided it's available.

**Joseph D'Errico** · 02-12-2004, 09:34 PM

Hi Rick, I think your final comment "Pricing is hard to pin down right now. The "old-hat" collectors think these prices are insane, but the newer guys don't seem to have any problems paying the price, for the quality, provided it's available." really hit it on the head.

@ Frank, I think that I am on the same page as you in that I have a number in my head as to what I feel I am prepared to pay for a badge even before I ask the price. I will leave a certain amount of room for tolerance given the variables. One of which is source, but that should not really be an issue if you have studied the piece which you are looking for. Agreed that thier are some collectors that are just flush with cash and like the hobby but will only buy from the best reputable dealers feeling they are taking no chances, logical if you have the cash and do not have the time or interest to do the homework. No real crime in that other than it keeps the prices going up.

Best,
JD

**BobI** · 02-12-2004, 10:28 PM

Hi,

I have a 100 GAB on my site as Rick mentioned. I personally feel my price is a little high and I marked it that way on porpoise. My reasoning was I almost hate to sell it! I think realistically it would sell for 3K, perhaps a little more. For a mint one I would say 3200-3600 in the real world. I do think these are much rarer than RKs and almost any other badge I can imagine. All my opinion though!

Best Wishes,

Bob

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