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**Rick Research** · 12-16-2001, 05:18 PM

In my experience with "zinky crud" there is NOTHING that will "clean" without also stripping all remaining finish off.

You will end up with a badge with NO finish at all.

This is the price of collecting "we'll upgrade to better quality after Final Victory" stuff 60 years after the war's end, unfortunately!

**cicero** · 12-16-2001, 05:35 PM

you can do almost nothing against zinc based badge's
in the long run,even when you store them in the best condidions,they will lose their finnish and turned to black
i would leave it that way

glenn

**Hugh W. Brock** · 12-22-2001, 11:37 PM

The source of the problem is under the finish and is due either to improper preparation prior to finishing (badge was not degreased, cleaned) in which case the finish has adhered to the dirt and over time is sloughed off, or because of reaction between various elements in the metal alloy. The reactions create byproducts that increase in size as well as change in composition, pushing the finish up from inside and resulting in bubbles in the finish which eventually rupture exposing (usually) gray powdery residue or nothing (if caused by the creation of gas).
If you keep an item at room temperature with no radical swings in temperature and with controlled humidity (households with central air/heat are usually pretty dry), deterioration should be slow.
I would be very concerned if an item suddenly deteriorated after 55 odd years. Most of the badges that were going to lose finish had lost most of it within 10 or so years. Usually if it is atmospheric (like umidity accelerates rust) or something the items are in contact or proximity to, all the items are likely to show some sign of deterioration. High humidity causes mildew to grow on surfaces also.

**prvtdck** · 12-23-2001, 01:08 AM

Hi Kjel, you show little of the badge it's hard to determine or even surmise a cause. I am afraid you might have purchased a "new" badge and it is only (now) beginning to show the effects of the zink!
Please, show the reverse etc., and all might fall in to the proper view.
It is hardly reasonable that after 60 +/- years it only "now" starts!
Dave

**Mark S.** · 12-23-2001, 02:08 AM

Here is something really weird.

I bought this 65 silver wound badge in May of this year. I put it in a Riker mount with several other items. 6 months later, it looks like this. Nothing else in the mount was affected in any way, and as for atmospheric conditions, nothing else in my collection is any different than the day I got it.

The badge was bright and shiny when I got it, and now is a dull gray color. I investigated this badge pretty thoroughly when I got it, and never had any reason to suspect it might be fake, but now I am not so sure.

Anyway, thats the only conclusion could come up with as to why it did this. If it is fake, then it fooled one of our favorite dealers, as well as me. Any one else have any other thoughts?

[ 22 December 2001: Message edited by: M. Schroeder ]

**Warren O** · 12-24-2001, 02:03 AM

If the wound badge was sitting on felt that could be the problem. I had a GAB that turned black because of felt. I've also found that ordinary mineral oil that you buy at the drug store will remove corrosion from zinc badges.
Warren

**Chris Boonzaier** · 12-24-2001, 05:33 AM

Small plug for WD40. A tiny bit on a Qtip makes zink corrosion dissapear right away.

**Mark S.** · 12-24-2001, 01:49 PM

The wound badge was directly on the "angel hair" type white stuff that came with the mount.

I have since removed it from the mount, just to be safe.

**CSP** · 12-24-2001, 01:59 PM

Go to an art or hobby store and buy a spray can of artist's clear flat laquer. This is the stuff that charcoal and pencil artists use to keep their work from smudging after they are done.

If you wish, luke warm water with a tiny amount of dish soap and a gentle scrub with the finger, followed by about 10 minutes of drying with a hair dryer will remove the powdery layer on a piece.

Then spary the clear flat sheen on Very lightly....maybe two coats of just barely giving it a squirt. Do not get too close to the piece - stay about a foot away - else you get a build up of laquer. In any case, it truely dries clear and flat and is otherwise undetectable. It stops the corrosive spread of 'zink crud'.

Now, I have only tried this once on a silver driver's proficiency badge that, except for the corrosion occuring, was the nicest piece I had ever seen of this badge. I did this 5 -6 years ago and all remains in order. Not sure what it will look like in 50 more years, but it probablly will not have zinc crud.

Scott

**Warren O** · 12-24-2001, 06:59 PM

Scott,
I've used the lacquer finish too and agree its the best way to seal the zinc after the corrosion has been removed. In fact it saved my zinc based AFRIKA medal from furthur damage.
Warren

**hawksy** · 12-26-2001, 04:13 PM

Hello Everyone,
This does seem a bit weird, after sixty odd years of being left in some of the most terrible places a badge or any other metal objects could be left in, thats apart from when the soldier who earned it wore in all the rain coverd in mud and any other nasty thing that the soldier whent through, suddenly we collectors gets hold of it and it starts to corrode,things starts to happen to it, like i said it does seem weird to me.

lee.

**Hugh W. Brock** · 12-28-2001, 02:15 PM

It is possible the 65 wound badge had been refinished.
Silver finish is either 1)electro-plating or 2)silver wash (paint bath). If the paint is holding to the pin/catch/hinge and it is brass, steel, etc., then the metal alloy is loosening the finish---some chemical change is occuring in the metal resulting in the surface powdering and it and the finish come off. I have seen 2 WH marked IAB's that had perfect satin silver on the pin assembly parts and not a bit on the zinc badge (just a dull powdery gray). You could brasso them to a bright silver color, and paint would keep them bright longer by cutting off atmospheric elements. On my guns, if they had rust and I rubbed it down until it was just a brown color (no raised rust)and kept it well oiled and came back in 30 years I found the rust had "grown" up again. The reason is that iron oxide has oxygen, and that causes more iron oxide. The low grade zinc alloys with foreign elements will continue to deteriorate. You can just slow it down. TEMPERATURE AND HUMIDITY CONTROL ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTORS.
Putting lacquer or acrylic on your items can result in that finish yellowing or coming loose later and make a bigger mess. If your item has a painted finish, any solvent you use to take the lacquer, acrylic or varnish off may take off finish too. I have lacquered items in the distant past. I do not do it now. I clean, sometimes with WD40 (if iron is present)or warm water (sterling silver, brass)and hand soap and then rub well with a silicon treated soft cloth. This SEEMS to work. Have only had deterioration on one badge out of 100's kept the same way (wood hinged cases with foam backing and imitation velvet or wool cover) in a dehumidified room. All of this stuff will be dust one day! If only one item is having a problem, see if any of the other items made of the same material with the same type finish are having problems.

**Thomas Durante** · 12-28-2001, 10:43 PM

Kjell, the badge you show is a blowup of the one one your webpage under Heer, right? That bronze FLL is a know reproduction, made I believe in the late 1970s. As Hugh stated above, the badge may have been refinished before you got it, and has been deteriorating ever since.

Tom

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