Closing in on "A.S. in a triangle"

[Tom Yanacek]

Hello to all,

As far as I know, we still do not have a positive confirmation on what manufacturer used the "A.S. in a triangle" logo. The debate has gone back and forth between Ad. Schwerdt of Stuttgart and Adolf Scholze of Grünwald an der Neiße. I think the lean has been towards Adolf Scholze because of their proximity to the town of Gablonz and because the hardware setups on A.S. in a triangle badges seem to emulate those of other Gablonz manufacturers.

I stumbled onto something that may bring us one step closer to knowing for certain:

Take a look at this logo (below) which is from the reverse of a 1914-1918 Cross of Honor without Swords. The logo is a downward pointing sword flanked by the letters A and S. I have seen this logo identified as belonging to Alfred Stubbe of Berlin and, for a good number of reasons, I myself thought that that was the most likely possibility.

However, the photo on the next posting will show that this is definitely not the logo of Alfred Stubbe....

[Tom Yanacek]

Here is the same logo on the back of a "Tag der Arbeit" tinnie. The tinnie not only has the logo but also the manufacturer's name spelled out: Ad. Schwerdt.

This picture can be found on page #323 of Mark Woods' book: German Medal Makers and Their Marks 1813-1957 (second edition). A very nice book, by the way, loaded with lots of good information and everyone should get a copy.

Since we can now confirm the logo used by Ad. Schwerdt (sword flanked by A and S) we have one more bit of evidence to associate the A.S. in a triangle logo to Adolf Scholze of Grünwald a.d. Neiße.

Notice also that the manufacturer name does not have the first and second initials as many references have shown: A. D. Schwerdt but rather a first name abbreviation Ad. Schwerdt (probably Adolf or Adelbert I would think).

Best regards,
Tom

[Tom Yanacek]

This has convinced me once again that tinnies are a good thing to study. Not only because most are marked, but because many will carry both the manufacturers name and logo. We might be able to use tinnies to solve many more manufacturer mysteries than we realize.

Best regards,
Tom

[Don D.]

I believe a former employee of Adolf Scholze confirmed they always used the A.S. mark. That would indicate that we are looking for a 3d maker.

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Tom,

Great thread and discovery! I have been meaning to buy that book too, just for this very reason.

I agree with Don though that we are probably looking for a 3rd maker. Skip actually made a phone call to the Adolf Scholze firm about 2 or 3 years ago and they confirmed that they always used A.S. as their logo. So the maker of the "AS in Triangle" is still a mystery to be solved.

I think we are still on the right track with a Gablonz maker though, we just need to find one with the right initials.......it has been fruitless so far

Tom

[Don D.]

At least we've eliminated one suspect.

[bobcam1]

One cannot BUY this type of education!

I LOVE this forum....

[Peter J.]

"One cannot BUY this type of education!

I LOVE this forum...."

I echo that
cheers
Peter

[Tom Yanacek]

I think we are still on the right track with a Gablonz maker though, we just need to find one with the right initials.......it has been fruitless so far

Hi guys,

Well, if we are looking for some other manufacturer from the Gablonz area having the initials A.S., I would consider Adolf Seidel of Gablonz an der Neiße. They are the only other Gablonz firm that I could find having the initials A.S. I don't know if Seidel produced medals and badges, but they certainly were a "metal goods" producer for tinnies and day badges. They were licensed by the RZM and had the manufacturer code M9/293. I have never seen their name on a listing of Lieferant (chancellery suppliers) or LDO (commercial suppliers) numbers, but that does not mean they didn't produce awards because there are quite a few numbers that are still unknown to this day.

Also, I still would not dismiss the possibility that Adolf Scholze may have used the AS in a triangle logo. While I can certainly appreciate the primary source of an employee that worked for the Scholze firm and would naturally place a good deal of weight on his statements, we must remember too that recollection after all of these years may not be the best. Would his statements be supported by other employees of the Scholze firm? Did the guy work there the entire time that wartime badges were being produced by the Scholze firm?

Are the Panzer Badges marked A.S. and AS in a triangle both made off of the identical obverse die? Just taking a quick glance I would say yes, but I never really compared them that closely. (Maybe I will have to study a few of mine?)

Best regards,
Tom

[Tom Yanacek]

Just had a thought on why Ad. Schwerdt may have used this logo with the sword:

The last name of Schwerdt is very close in spelling to the German word Schwert, which means sword. Purely speculation on my part but it does seem to make sense now. And I think I need to get a life.