Tut, Tut Herr Winkler-3.5k fake SS Award

[J C Gray]

I have just found this on the History Shop site...the infamous (and very ugly) Two-piece Fake SS-Service Award. His description is as follows:
ss LONG SERVICE AWARD for 25 YEARS, with the ribbon (without runes), tear drop-shaped ring, attached oak leaves ring, fine quality, in dream condition with bright mercury gilding, extremely rare original.

I must say that I am a tad surprised by this listing, as he has sold many original examples of this medal in the past.

BTW. You can buy the same example for as little as $20.00 if you really want this abomination.

[J C Gray]

Reverse...

[clevischi]

[Oberbootsmann]

May I ask why this medal is fake?

[J C Gray]

It is the infamous 'Two-Piece' Fake...probably the most commonly available reproduction of this award around and hence, one of the cheapest. These are available from most of the re-enactor suppliers from between £11.99 and £24.99, which is ever so slightly cheaper than what this one was going for.
The wreath on all original 1st. & 2nd. Grade SS-Service Awards should be an integral part of the award and not a cheap, ugly, cast, seperate part which has been Super-glued onto a swastika that bears only a passing resemblance to an original.
Is this the one that you were enquiring about on the other thread?

[Scott C.]

At least it's in "dream condition"...

[The Dragon]

I did a search on Kai-Winkler before nothing but bad reviews.

Some of the collectors who had been around when Winkler first started out didnt do business with him because he was selling fakes and because of his shoddy business dealings. Yet some how over the years he has become acceptable.

J C Gray said it all when the words cheap and ugly were mentioned about the medal below IMO.

[jabnus]

This is indeed obvious a fake, even for non SS collectors. The hollow wreath is the big give away, also i don't see the flaw in the "T"? (or is that me? )

[EK-collector]

he sold fake memelland medal recently aswell.

[bytown]

Buy Beware.

Wayne

[DTS]

I kind of like how the capital "I" is dotted. Never heard of that being done in English... or German.

[Oberbootsmann]

May besomeone can provide photos of an original example of such an award. I've just found fakes and small pictures on the Internet. I'd like to compare, especially the "I" dots and the "T". Thanks for mentioning that anyway.

[Stan]

SS Medals

A very well-known forum member bought this medal a couple of years ago and proudly emailed me the photos. I told him it was a fake and he promptly returned it and got a refund.

Stan

[Stan]

SS Medals

May besomeone can provide photos of an original example of such an award. I've just found fakes and small pictures on the Internet. I'd like to compare, especially the "I" dots and the "T". Thanks for mentioning that anyway.

This is what an original "one-piece" cross looks like. It is ex-Col C.M. Dodkins collection and is shown in his 1968 book.

Stan

[J C Gray]

This thread is about a year and a half old and I was not aware that the item was still for sale.
I have bought many fine items from Kai Winkler and would do so again, however, I firmly believe that he is mistaken in this case.
I think that the confusion with this particular repro can be traced back to the fact that way back in the early '70s, it appeared as an undeclared 'hole filler' (along with all that crap about the Kampfzeit counting as double) in Jack Pia's "SS Regalia"...I have since read on this forum about many such substitutes being used in the two Pia books. This confusion has also been exacerbated by the apparent similarity to the period illustration of the 12 year SS-Service Award that appears in the 1943 edition of Heinrich Doehle's book "Die Auszeichnungen des Großdeutchen Reichs". Whilst most of the illustrations in this book are extremely accurate and are probably hand coloured photographs of the actual awards, the 12 year example is one of the less accurate renderings and I believe that the repro in question could have been copied from this painting...there has been much reference to this repro being one of Souvals' "post war souveniers", but I have no proof of this.