4 Piece Luftwaffe Medal Bar.

[Lynton Battrick]

Hi,
I can't see any problems with this 4 piece medal bar, but I thought I would check on here to get a general opinion.
Everything on it looks ok to me,any thoughts from any one else?
Many thanks,Lynton.

[Lynton Battrick]

Reverse,Thanks for looking.
Lynton.

[Lynton Battrick]

I thought i would get this Zinc Africa medal checked while i'm here.Any opinions on this please?
Thanks.

[Lynton Battrick]

Reverse.

[Lynton Battrick]

Obverse.

[mrg]

Hi Lynton the zinc Afrika looks like an worn original cannot make out the maker name, but it looks as if it is there is that the case? As for the medal bar, is it possible to have a closer look at the Prague Bar. all the best.

[Scott C.]

The Prague bar caught my eye too, along with the way the ribbons are loosly furled in the front and tucked up tight in back, rather than "fanned" out behind each medal. Curious to hear what others say.

Scott

[McCulloh]

It was a style used as one can see (squinting) in the wedding photos thread.
Whoever made it did a neat job and the order seems ok-says support/technical Luftwaffe man to me-exactly like a Nachricten Obrlt. or NCO would have had in 1942/3 when he came back to get married.
I also am unsure about the Prague bar and would really have to hold this one to be comfortable with it (and blacklight it).
No obvious warning bells though, except its freshness (which isn't all that bad considering it may have been worn only twice) and maybe that bar.
15 years ago bars were worth a little less than the sum of their parts-people used to rip them apart to sell singles. I bought bars like this for $85-$100 in 1997 (without the bar). With the advent of the internet and serious researchers/ historians looking at these, there is now a "spangen bonus"-that is values are sometimes 100% MORE than the items as individual pieces.
So now one has to be very,very careful.

[James Clark]

I have had the chance to examine a bar like this - same ribbed backing, same bent over retaining hook, same pin, same stitching. The medals were all genuine as far as I could tell but I did not like the way the bar was put together. And an awful lot of them appeared round about the same time from Austria.

I don't know the "wedding photo" referred to, but yes, there are full size bars mounted in the same way as the furled (so called south German or Austrian style) ribbon bars, with the ribbons flat rather than sewen into a rosette at the bottom. But they are put together in a quite different way to this bar.

I would also like to see the back of the ribbon bar. I don't think it looks good from the front.

[mrg]

Hi guys i am fairly sure the bar is the type with the large expanse of windows all neatly formed have examined these at various shows and they do not appear original. These bars started to pop up out of nowhere on mass, colouration looks very artifical all the bars i have seen look identicle in colouration. The awards i have to say look nice originals.

[McCulloh]

what's the ribbon bar back look like?

Also, about 15 years ago a large number of these types of bars began to flow out of Bavaria-with almost pristine metal backings. Some were sold by dealers we all know well in the UK.

Bottom line is for me: I don't know. I am 60/40 in favour of it being ok, but the concerns the others have are all the same ones I have. I think we all agree that the medals seem originals, but whether it was put together pre 1945 or post 1945 is the big question. 15 years ago it made no economic sense to put these together-now it does.
The "south german" style, as Rick R. refers to it, actually has a number of different types of stitching patterns, but the above narrow stitching on a ribbed ribbon has certainly been used on orginal AND made up bars-many of which appeared on german ebay and via dealers. Some were obvious because 10 years ago (+) the maker(s) produced monster bars with medals way out of oreder and silly combinations. I have an Austrian bar that I think was produced by this chap (although it was ok'd by a number of guys who know more than me), but in the past few years we are seeing bars that really show no obvious problems-except similar construction techniques and freshness.

[Lynton Battrick]

Hi,
Thanks for all of your input on this one, I have learnt alot reading this!
I no longer have this bar to show any more photos, as it was being offered to me with other items and I had it on an inspection period.
I decided not to have this from the other party because of the doubt over it.
I can say however in response to the above thread that the bar did in fact have a very shiney, almost pristine metal backing plate!It's a shame I didn't get a photo of it! I must say though that I didn't doubt the group at all at first as I was happy with the medals themselves-so I have leant something from this anyway!

Cheers,Lynton.

[McCulloh]

This was and is a really interesting thread. I got a series of "pristine backing plate" medal bars almost all from an English dealer about 10 years ago. Subsequently in comparison to other ars I have obtained from places like FJP auctions, from older collections and in a few cases-directly from vets, I have strong doubts about these. The metal back plates are just too easy to clip in -whereas the cloth backed ones take real effort and some skill.
I am considering putting up a thread about fake bars. Any interest?
I have met some collectors who have made PERFECT bars-primarly just to see if they could do it and I have ripped up a bar that was an obvious fake from ebay 8 years ago. In doing so I have learned a bit about construction techniques and problems (like fragile ribbons, wear patterns and thread types).
Many of these bars are made with original medals. Some dealers/collectors have real problems with different wear patterns of medals on bars -e.g. a pristine EK2 and a worn Ost medal etc.. This is certainly something to look for, but I interviewed a Luftwaffe NCO a few years back (he was a guest at the local WW2 vets club meeting) and he told me that he had his medal bar done in 1944 for his wedding and wore it only 2 days. (It was lost) However, he had used the medals he was awarded and as he actually worn his Westwall medal and long service medal before 1941 (being shipped off to Russia) on weekly parade, these medals were far more worn than his "bright" (his word) KVKx and Ek. He was surprised and very suspcious of my questions.